[whereagles]

I've done it on

KQJT
xx
xxxx
xxx

pass pass 2♠

[han]

jdonn, on Apr 21 2008, 11:54 PM, said:

han, on Apr 21 2008, 05:23 PM, said:

Well, I don't know if I could pass with KQJ109 even when red, but I really try to have 6.

Is that another way of saying you pray to the skies not to hold 5, since when that's what you hold you bid it anyway?

No, it's not. I think that if you try a little harder even you might still get what I meant.

[pclayton]

FrancesHinden, on Apr 22 2008, 02:25 AM, said:

bill1157, on Apr 21 2008, 10:53 PM, said:

While we are on the subject of extreme weak-2's, how do people feel about opening a weak 2 with a 5 card suit?  What criteria would you have for this action?

Bill

extreme? What's extreme about a 5-card suit?

favourable vulnerability, third seat

P P ?

xx
AQJx
xx
xxxxx

We've all done it, but I'm content opening 1 on these hands.

[Flame]

lets say opening this give you 55% result on the board i would still not open it.
That because i would open 2H on much different hands and i will lose more when partner wont know when i have garbage and when i have a nice 2H.

[Apollo81]

FrancesHinden, on Apr 22 2008, 06:25 AM, said:

favourable vulnerability, third seat

P P ?

xx
AQJx
xx
xxxxx

I've done it on worse 4-card heart suits than that one =)

[Apollo81]

rogerclee, on Apr 21 2008, 06:23 AM, said:

Here is a debate between matmat and me over what constitutes a normal preempt.

White vs Red, IMPs, First Seat

♠Qx ♥987xxx ♦QTxx ♣x

What is your call?

I don't think it's a normal preempt, but I would open 2♥ regardless of scoring. In my mind the biggest danger is that we get the wrong lead, not that we go for a number. The playing strength of this hand is fine. Thus I am happier with this decision at IMPs, where a bad lead only costs if the contract wouldnt have made on a better lead.

A hand like xx KJxxx xx xxxx is a hand where I would preempt at MPs 3rd fav (for the lead) but not at IMPs bc of the high number risk.

[PassedOut]

whereagles, on Apr 22 2008, 05:38 AM, said:

I've done it on

KQJT
xx
xxxx
xxx

pass pass 2♠

I used to do this too (weak jump overcalls similarly) until all my partners fell in love with the law of total tricks.

One trouble with preempting with long weak suits is that those bids often steer the opponents into a 3NT that makes -- when a normal suit contract fails because of bad breaks. OTOH, preempting with a strong 4-card suit can talk the opponents out of bidding a making 3NT.

[Flameous]

This one depends, if I'm playing magic D with weak twos or some other system with aggressive openings, it's 2♥ or occasionally even 3. With stronger openings, I also tend to have atleast something in pre-empts so there is some use for Ogust or alike conventions. Third seat this is obvious 3♥ though.

[skjaeran]

With my regular I play constructive weak 2s in the majors, so this isn't close to 2M for me.

But NV we play garbage Multi, so it would be a clear 2♦ opening for me at these colours.

[bill1157]

whereagles, on Apr 22 2008, 05:38 AM, said:

I've done it on

KQJT
xx
xxxx
xxx

pass pass 2♠

It looks to me like opening 2S on this hand would be an antipercentage action. Would you do it on the last hand of a big event that you were leading?
Anyway, I would be interested to hear how this type of opening actually worked out.

Bill

[han]

Not very long ago I jump-overcalled 2H on AQJ10 and out, white against red. My passed hand partner raised on xxx, the opponents doubled and I went for a big big number.

Judging from their reactions my teammates (BBO team game) were not pleased.

[lexlogan]

I was misled by the title into thinking you were considering 3♥ at this vulnerability. 2♥ is a semi-constructive call, not a preempt to my way of thinking; such a bid in first or second seat would never occur to me. I'd THINK about 3♥, then pass, hopefully in tempo.

[bill1157]

han, on Apr 30 2008, 06:32 PM, said:

Not very long ago I jump-overcalled 2H on AQJ10 and out, white against red. My passed hand partner raised on xxx, the opponents doubled and I went for a big big number.

Judging from their reactions my teammates (BBO team game) were not pleased.

I guess to have any likelyhood of success with weak 2's on 4 card suits, you would need to have the agreement that you could do that. Then your partner would only raise with Hxx plus a ruffing value.

Bill

[FrancesHinden]

bill1157, on Apr 30 2008, 09:52 PM, said:

whereagles, on Apr 22 2008, 05:38 AM, said:

I've done it on

KQJT
xx
xxxx
xxx

pass pass 2♠

It looks to me like opening 2S on this hand would be an antipercentage action. Would you do it on the last hand of a big event that you were leading?
Anyway, I would be interested to hear how this type of opening actually worked out.

Bill

I wouldn't do it on the last hand of a big event that I was leading (if only...) but that doesn't make it antipercentage, it just makes it high variance.

Anyway, I make 4-card pre-empts/weak jump extremely rarely and they have had mixed success.

[whereagles]

Would I do it on a big event when I'm leading? In the system I'm playing these days, opps are 100% cold for a game and pard knows better to raise me on 3 cards.

So, yeah I would.

What happened at table on that hand? Don't remember exactly, but opps overcalled and ended up in 3NT +1 or something like that.

[jchiu]

pclayton, on Apr 22 2008, 03:21 PM, said:

FrancesHinden, on Apr 22 2008, 02:25 AM, said:

bill1157, on Apr 21 2008, 10:53 PM, said:

While we are on the subject of extreme weak-2's, how do people feel about opening a weak 2 with a 5 card suit?  What criteria would you have for this action?

Bill

extreme? What's extreme about a 5-card suit?

favourable vulnerability, third seat

P P ?

xx
AQJx
xx
xxxxx

We've all done it, but I'm content opening 1 on these hands.

This surely implies that you're getting old, Mr. Clayton ...