[rogerclee]

IMPs, White vs Red, First Seat

♠AQx ♥void ♦AJTxx ♣AQT9x

1♦ - (P) - 3♦ - (Dbl)
4♥ - (P) - 5♣ - (P)
?

3♦ was "preemptive" by the standards of a normal pickup partnership that plays inverted minors.

Agree with 4♥? Now what?

[han]

I think I would have bid 5D over 3D but now this looks very good. I'd bid 6D, even 7 might have good chances opposite the perfect dummy.

[kfay]

I think 7 is a longshot. 6 looks like it will have its share of problems even if 5♣ shows the K (♠, trump loser) to me so I'll content myself with 6.

[gnasher]

Assuming that the only diamond raises he had were 2♦ and 3♦, it's possible for partner to have xxx xxx KQxx Kxx or xxx xx Kxxxx Kxx. I'd bid 5NT (GSF).

Partner should treat Kxxxx as two top honours, because he knows that I have at least Axxxx, and he knows that I know he can't have AKxxx as well as ♣K.

[rogerclee]

gnasher, on Jul 14 2008, 10:02 AM, said:

Partner should treat Kxxxx as two top honours, because he knows that I have at least Axxxx, and he knows that I know he can't have AKxxx as well as ♣K.

I think this is a big issue. Would you ever bid 5♣ on a stiff?

[kenrexford]

Damn I wish I knew more about partner's style.

It sounds like he has something like ♠xxx ♥xxx ♦Kxxxx ♣Kx. I'll have some trouble making 7 if the diamonds split 3-0 and the clubs 4-2 (Jack protected). I can establish my clubs in that event, and hook the spade (probably working), but then I have another loser. I might pitch it on the diamonds on a heart lead (ruff, club to King, ruff, diamond Ace, club Ace, ruff club, ruff heart, diamond up), but then I need the diamond 9 from partner.

If partner has the diamond Queen, that's a fairly strong hand, but that does increase my chances a lot. A third club would be nice, as well, as I might have a lesser need for a club ruff. I'm not sure where this is going, but I cannot imagine 7 lacking play if partner bids it, and he will be real hesitant to bid it blindly, so maybe one more stab at the grand makes sense.

5♥ seems right. Definite void, definite grand interest. If partner bids something interesting, I might move. Still wondering...

ADDED: Just saw that 5♣ could be a stiff. Yes, I agree. It could. He better not cooperate with the grand try is he has that, though. Plus, that seems to make him with six diamonds, and I'd probably have hope in the grand, actually. Both finesses don't have to work, but they might.

[gnasher]

rogerclee, on Jul 14 2008, 06:04 PM, said:

I think this is a big issue. Would you ever bid 5♣ on a stiff?

I don't think he should.

If he has, with something like xxx xxx Kxxxxx x, he certainly shouldn't then claim to hold two top trump honours. He should be aware that I'm probably visualising a top club in his hand, and so may not have all the tricks I think I've got.

Finally, if I find myself in 7♦ opposite this, I won't mind much. I have 11 tricks on top and will take the odds-on club finesse for 12. My 13th will come from either a long club or a spade finesse.

[gnasher]

kenrexford, on Jul 14 2008, 06:08 PM, said:

It sounds like he has something like ♠xxx ♥xxx ♦Kxxxx ♣Kx. I'll have some trouble making 7 if the diamonds split 3-0 and the clubs 4-2 (Jack protected). I can establish my clubs in that event, and hook the spade (probably working), but then I have another loser.

What's 5 + 4 + 2 + 2?

[kenrexford]

gnasher, on Jul 14 2008, 12:27 PM, said:

kenrexford, on Jul 14 2008, 06:08 PM, said:

It sounds like he has something like ♠xxx ♥xxx ♦Kxxxx ♣Kx.  I'll have some trouble making 7 if the diamonds split 3-0 and the clubs 4-2 (Jack protected).  I can establish my clubs in that event, and hook the spade (probably working), but then I have another loser.

What's 5 + 4 + 2 + 2?

Oh yeah -- I only need to ruff one club. Duh!

The more I think about this, maybe I should bid 6♣.

[pclayton]

I wouldn't ever take 5♣ as a stiff, and I refuse to open that whole can of worms again. If pard has a slam try without a club or spade control, 4N is available.

I do agree with 5♥. We really don't need much and the ♠K has to be on.

[mikeh]

Jlall, on Jul 14 2008, 03:52 PM, said:

Why can't 5C be a stiff, I don't get it? A stiff club is a great feature to have on this auction, I would certainly cuebid it if I had it. I don't agree with 4H, I would have bid 4C to show my second suit but 4H is ok.

To expand on this, if 5♣ is a stiff, the odds are very high that partner has 6 diamonds.. on the assumption that he would have bid a major with 4 of them... now, he might bid 3♦ on 432 5432 KQxxx x, but I'd bet against it in this era of 5 card majors.

And if he is xxx xxx Kxxxxx x, I like my chances in 6♦. Heck, I like my chances in grand.

[jtfanclub]

Why isn't anybody opening this 2♣?

Just messin' witcha. It would not occur to me at the table to bid 4♥, but I like it. Curious as to how 5♥ and 5♠ would be interpreted.

[rogerclee]

Okay I just wanted to see what people would do. I was torn between 6♦ and 5♥/5NT.

What actually happened at the table wasn't bridge, so I guess it's not really relevant. Partner had ♠Jxx ♥Jxx ♦Kxxxx ♣Kx and 7♦ rolls home easy. I don't think this is a 3♦ call, but whatever.

(On top of this, partner failed to bid 5♣; he signed off in 5♦. This turned out to be sort of a winning action when LHO sacrificed in 5♥ and misplayed it a trick for 1400. lol)

[gnasher]

rogerclee, on Jul 15 2008, 05:55 AM, said:

Partner had ♠Jxx ♥Jxx ♦Kxxxx ♣Kx

In a "normal pickup partnership that plays inverted minors", what should this hand respond?

[rogerclee]

gnasher, on Jul 15 2008, 01:24 AM, said:

rogerclee, on Jul 15 2008, 05:55 AM, said:

Partner had ♠Jxx ♥Jxx ♦Kxxxx ♣Kx

In a "normal pickup partnership that plays inverted minors", what should this hand respond?

1NT. My comment about "not being bridge" was not directed at this call but what later happened.

[gnasher]

"Inverted minors" used to mean that you invert the two- and three-level raises. That is, you bid 3♦ with hand worth the two level and 2♦ with a hand worth the three level or more. Maybe the method needs a new name.