BBO Discussion Forums: Ben on BBO - Feedback thread - BBO Discussion Forums

Jump to content

  • 9 Pages +
  • « First
  • 6
  • 7
  • 8
  • 9
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

Ben on BBO - Feedback thread Discussions about Ben models trained on BBO data

#141 User is offline   thorvald 

  • PipPipPipPip
  • Group: Full Members
  • Posts: 376
  • Joined: 2012-September-05
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Denmark

Posted 2024-May-16, 14:54

View Postpescetom, on 2024-May-16, 12:46, said:

I imagine it's more the fault of BBO than Ben, but the explanation of 2NT as 15+HCP is not even funny.


Well according to GIB 2NT is the strong answer to a weak 2, so the explanation is correct, but West (BEN) was bluffing :-)

Over 2N North did not have the HCP for bidding 6 as it would show 32+ total points, and settled for 5C. After the double GIB has the same explanation for both Pass and 6C, so BEN probably picked up somewhere that with 12 tricks it is a good idea to bid the slam.

But a really nice hand.
Thorvald Aagaard
Mobile : +45 22 99 55 25
http://www.netbridge.dk
http://www.thorvald.dk
0

#142 User is offline   TwoOneBEN 

  • PipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 14
  • Joined: 2024-April-29

Posted 2024-May-31, 09:31

Inconsistent bidding.

Playing the "Ben and Friends daily" it is important, that BEN bids the same at all tables when we as South bid the same, otherwise, the result will have no value


This was the bidding at about 15 tables, and the best declarer managed 12 tricks and a fine score, but at my table this happened


2 down and a score of 97.6% even after dropping a trick.

Just pure luck.
I am BEN the Bridge ENgine
1

#143 User is offline   TwoOneBEN 

  • PipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 14
  • Joined: 2024-April-29

Posted 2024-June-01, 06:30

Difficult to defend playing with BEN



After trick 1 I would assume K is in declarers hand.

It could look like BEN is playing the card it would lead starting the suit, and I have seen it in many situations, like playing J from JT in 3rd hand.
I am BEN the Bridge ENgine
0

#144 User is offline   TwoOneBEN 

  • PipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 14
  • Joined: 2024-April-29

Posted 2024-June-01, 06:54

Trick 11 looks strange

5 at trick 9 looks right, but that error did no harm.
Not using 5 at trick 11 just dropped a trick.
I am BEN the Bridge ENgine
0

#145 User is offline   TwoOneBEN 

  • PipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 14
  • Joined: 2024-April-29

Posted 2024-June-04, 05:39

Deleted double post
I am BEN the Bridge ENgine
0

#146 User is offline   TwoOneBEN 

  • PipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 14
  • Joined: 2024-April-29

Posted 2024-June-04, 05:43

It seems I am pretty alone on the feedback thread, but yesterday I had this annoying board.



and got a bad score (terrible defense by BEN in North - look at trick 10). Perhaps I should bid 2 in South.

But going through the boards I noticed:

Board was played 39 times

South open 1N once, and 1 38 times
When South opened 1 West doubled once, and overcalled 1N twice, but 35 times West passed.

Strange if BEN use the same Neural Network
I am BEN the Bridge ENgine
0

#147 User is online   pilowsky 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 3,774
  • Joined: 2019-October-04
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Poland

Posted 2024-June-04, 07:05

View PostTwoOneBEN, on 2024-June-04, 05:43, said:

It seems I am pretty alone on the feedback thread...

In space no-one can hear you scream.
Fortuna Fortis Felix
0

#148 User is online   smerriman 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 4,045
  • Joined: 2014-March-15
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2024-June-14, 00:09


Well, that didn't go well..
0

#149 User is offline   helene_t 

  • The Abbess
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 17,201
  • Joined: 2004-April-22
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Copenhagen, Denmark
  • Interests:History, languages

Posted 2024-June-16, 11:13

Ben doesn't understand that doubles are penalty when partner has preempted, e.g.,
2-(3)-x-(p)
3!
The world would be such a happy place, if only everyone played Acol :) --- TramTicket
0

#150 User is offline   TwoOneBEN 

  • PipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 14
  • Joined: 2024-April-29

Posted 2024-June-23, 12:59

View Postsmerriman, on 2024-June-14, 00:09, said:


Well, that didn't go well..


I think it is more interesting that West bid 3.
It is probably because there is an error in the GIB definitions, where both 3 and 3 is 2+ and less than 8 total points - but the actual hand match the definition of 4 in GIB perfect.

After the double 5 is defined as 1-4 ; 1-3 ; 1-3 ; 10- HCP; strong rebiddable ; 12+ total points. The hand match 4 but I assume BEN never have seen that sequence.

So when playing with BEN (GIB) it is not enough to see what our bid means but also the responses from partner
I am BEN the Bridge ENgine
0

#151 User is offline   TwoOneBEN 

  • PipPip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 14
  • Joined: 2024-April-29

Posted 2024-June-26, 06:49

As far as I can see we got two different defences but bidding and play was identical up the point




Look at West lead a trick 2
I am BEN the Bridge ENgine
0

#152 User is offline   helene_t 

  • The Abbess
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 17,201
  • Joined: 2004-April-22
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Copenhagen, Denmark
  • Interests:History, languages

Posted 2024-July-08, 05:21

(2)-x-(xx)-?


I believe pass should now be penalty, not scrambling, but it seems that both doubler and advancer thought that pass is scrambling. Is this really GIB system, or is it some AI artefact?

https://tinyurl.com/2xw67ywa
The world would be such a happy place, if only everyone played Acol :) --- TramTicket
0

#153 User is offline   helene_t 

  • The Abbess
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 17,201
  • Joined: 2004-April-22
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Copenhagen, Denmark
  • Interests:History, languages

Posted 2024-July-08, 06:03

Passing a negative double with a void in the enemy suit
https://tinyurl.com/282bz845
The world would be such a happy place, if only everyone played Acol :) --- TramTicket
0

#154 User is online   pescetom 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 7,924
  • Joined: 2014-February-18
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Italy

Posted 2024-July-08, 06:22

 helene_t, on 2024-July-08, 05:21, said:

(2)-x-(xx)-?


I believe pass should now be penalty, not scrambling, but it seems that both doubler and advancer thought that pass is scrambling. Is this really GIB system, or is it some AI artefact?

https://tinyurl.com/2xw67ywa


The bidding is dubious, but the lead of anything but partner's suit is worse.
0

#155 User is online   pilowsky 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 3,774
  • Joined: 2019-October-04
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Poland

Posted 2024-July-14, 01:26

How many key cards does BEN have for the 5 bid?



Hmmm
Spoiler

Fortuna Fortis Felix
0

#156 User is online   smerriman 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 4,045
  • Joined: 2014-March-15
  • Gender:Male

Posted 2024-July-14, 01:53

Is there an issue? It showed 2, it had 2 (and 10 card fit = Q given you promised 3).

Granted, not many would play 4NT as RKC here, though GIB does, so..
1

#157 User is offline   helene_t 

  • The Abbess
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 17,201
  • Joined: 2004-April-22
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Copenhagen, Denmark
  • Interests:History, languages

Posted 2024-July-15, 13:40

A rule-of-20 hand including AKQ9x, who doesn't open in 3rd seat favourable?
https://tinyurl.com/2df3yd6h
The world would be such a happy place, if only everyone played Acol :) --- TramTicket
0

#158 User is offline   kcostell 

  • Pip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 9
  • Joined: 2020-October-12

Posted 2024-July-28, 00:34

https://tinyurl.com/26ej45e6

I'm not sure whether the issue is with Ben, BBO's explanations here, or my overly light preempt confusing things. Regardless, there was more than a little gap between what BBO was claiming Ben meant by his double of 5C and what he actually held.
0

#159 User is online   pescetom 

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Group: Advanced Members
  • Posts: 7,924
  • Joined: 2014-February-18
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Italy

Posted 2024-July-28, 09:43

 helene_t, on 2024-July-15, 13:40, said:

A rule-of-20 hand including AKQ9x, who doesn't open in 3rd seat favourable?
https://tinyurl.com/2df3yd6h

I would have opened the North hand too, in fourth seat with those spades.
0

#160 User is offline   queueiueue 

  • Pip
  • Group: Members
  • Posts: 4
  • Joined: 2023-August-17

Posted 2024-August-01, 02:16

Ben did not open with AKQJxxxxxx 10-card diamond suit (plus 3 singletons).

I'm serious. That hand was dealt. The bidding went P-(P)-1H-(P)-2D=. As opener I had "Kxx Qxxxx x AKJx" so I passed the second round as all bids are defined as strong. And then I saw these diamonds.

Sorry for lack of tinyurl because it is unavailable in my region.
0

  • 9 Pages +
  • « First
  • 6
  • 7
  • 8
  • 9
  • You cannot start a new topic
  • You cannot reply to this topic

14 User(s) are reading this topic
0 members, 14 guests, 0 anonymous users