[Phil]

Bbradley62, on 2012-October-18, 16:11, said:

So, when is a new player told "you can only ask questions when it's your turn"? And by whom? Not chastising such behavior is the equivalent of approving it. These people show up one day and they are no longer "C" players, so they discover that the rules have changed for them?

I usually find that these questions are not nefarious. They don't know better to wait until the proper time. Many veteran players get worked up about these matters, but the questions a newer player asks generally dont (edit) usually pinpoint interest in a suit.

I would never 'chastise' anything a new player does.

[Bbradley62]

So, you still don't ever tell them that they're supposed to wait until it's their turn? Help me here, Jillybean!

[paua]

Vampyr, on 2012-October-18, 15:05, said:

Why wait for the argument to start? I normally call the director as soon as an irregularity has occurred, and if it's not something obvious like a lead out of turn I will usually say something like "We'd better get the director here".

Suggesting that the director be called and then sitting back waiting for someone else to do it strikes me as obnoxious.

The Anglican vicar who taught me this would politley disagree with you.

[Bbradley62]

paua, on 2012-October-18, 19:03, said:

The Anglican vicar who taught me this would politley disagree with you.

Anglican vicars can't be obnoxious? I know several Catholic priests who are...

[aguahombre]

Vampyr, on 2012-October-18, 16:18, said:

I'm not sure, but what I think is being suggested is that these people are told the proper procedure at the table, without involving the director. I think this is probably OK, but that there may be a fine line between informing players of the correct procedure and making rulings at the table.

There is a way for a player or for a director to inform players of correct procedure without making a ruling or seeming to be making a ruling at the table. Wait for there to be no one else but you and the newbies ---between rounds or away from the table ---and use your vast communication skills to present the subject matter palatably.

[paua]

Bbradley62, on 2012-October-18, 19:59, said:

Anglican vicars can't be obnoxious? I know several Catholic priests who are...

blasphemer !

[phil_20686]

I agree with other Phil.

Also, it would help if you [jilly] cultivated a little bit of internal arrogance. When in your mind you start to think of all the club players as `basically beginners' even when they have been playing for 60 years, it becomes much easier to ignore their infractions, in the same way that you have no problem with for actual beginners.

I am reasonably sure this is the real reason that it is hard to find expert players who call the director on club players with any regularity.

[jillybean]

Where ignorance is bliss, 'tis folly to be wise.

[barmar]

jillybean, on 2012-October-18, 11:39, said:

Players are rarely called on these infractions and if they are called, it is likely the infraction will be glossed over.

It sounds like it's this "glossing" that compounds the problem.

If you only call the TD for serious issues in a club game, as Phil suggests (and I'm similar -- I can't recall ever calling the TD about UI in the club), and these still get ignored, then the director is not doing their job. While players may not enjoy being accused of doing something wrong, neither do people enjoy being ignored when they think they've been wronged in the first place. The TD should consider both side's concerns, but it sounds like many of them simply can't be bothered and don't want to deal with these types of calls. It seems wrong that they should err on the side of the offending side.