[han]

I say I would pass with the west hand, and suddenly everybody passes. That's what fame does for you.

[bluecalm]

I agree that W looks like insta pass at imps. Seems like we are collecting 500 quite often and sometimes game doesnt make = +EV.
4♣ is crazy. I would prefer to bid 3NT if anything, this looks like the most likely game.
As to E I don't know. 4♠ looks normal, but you never know what works in those auctions and what's the best way to bid.

[Phil]

cherdano, on 2011-May-27, 06:59, said:

ATB:

---

Well, at least 5♥ made. But that was a small consolation for the 800-1100 available against 3♣X.

Takes some imagination to get to 5♥ here I think.

[aguahombre]

cherdano, on 2011-May-27, 06:59, said:

ATB:

---

Well, at least 5♥ made. But that was a small consolation for the 800-1100 available against 3♣X.

Yeh, was thinking about posting a reverse of the majors. But figured that would bring in collateral discussion about East and the danger of doubling with that hand for fear of spade advances.

But the point being made by Cherdano still applies to many hands where double is the only option for East. (say, same high-cards but with 3-4-4-2).

[gnasher]

mgoetze, on 2011-May-27, 08:07, said:

What I haven't really figured out from the comments here: is 4♣ merely a bit worse than passing or is it really bad? I would have thought it showed some playability in both majors or an even stronger hand, and my alternative to pass would be 4♠ (or maybe 3NT?).

4♣ shows two (or three) places to play. That will often be both majors, but it could also be one major and diamonds. The sequences 4♣-4♦-4♠ and 4♣-4♥-4♠ show four spades and four or more diamonds.

One of the reasons for passing is that although it's likely that we can make game, we may not get to the right one: we could bid 3NT and risk not having enough tricks, or bid 4♠ and risk not having enough trumps, or bid 4♣ and risk having to play at the five-level opposite 3541 or even 3442.

[ArtK78]

TWO4BRIDGE, on 2011-May-26, 20:03, said:

E/W missed 6S+1 slam
3CX-3
- 11.2 IMPs instead of + 4.0 for slam

---

When I first saw the East hand, I thought that I would overcall 3♠. In all of the posts, the only options mentioned on the East hand are double and 4♠.

Is 3♠ on the East hand unreasonable? Yes, it is a little heavy, but given that it is my style that direct actions over preempts are sound, it is not very heavy. Replace the ♠J with a small spade and I think that 3♠ is clear.

[xxhong]

Mostly east, who has an easy 4S bid as it appears. West's hand is tough to bid, 3NT, 4S or pass are all possible spots. It is a matter of how aggressive your opp bids. Against aggressive players who frequently open 3C with balanced 6 card suit, un-balanced 5 card suit, it looks like a good time to pass. Playing against sound 3C openers and with conservative partner, it is probably ok to bid 3NT. Of course, sometimes, 4S can be the top spot when partner holds 4 or 5 S and the distribution isn't too terrible.
quote name='TWO4BRIDGE' timestamp='1306461807' post='549306']
E/W missed 6S+1 slam
3CX-3
- 11.2 IMPs instead of + 4.0 for slam

---

[/quote]

[JLOGIC]

ArtK78, on 2011-May-27, 09:44, said:

When I first saw the East hand, I thought that I would overcall 3♠. In all of the posts, the only options mentioned on the East hand are double and 4♠.

Is 3♠ on the East hand unreasonable? Yes, it is a little heavy, but given that it is my style that direct actions over preempts are sound, it is not very heavy. Replace the ♠J with a small spade and I think that 3♠ is clear.

Yes it is much too heavy. You have game in your own hand opposite Kx xxxxx Txx xxx or any number of hands like that. In general you should assume partner has 6 or 7 points and bid accordingly, if you have good play for game opposite 1 card, you certainly should drive there yourself.

Personally I think easts double is fine, overcalling 4S risks missing diamonds. How would you feel when dummy hit with x Kxx Axxxxx xxx or something when you overcalled 4S? And it is not like partner passing our double is a huge downside, often that will be right, just not when he has 4 spades!

[MrAce]

Phil, on 2011-May-27, 09:12, said:

Takes some imagination to get to 5♥ here I think.

And even if it does, west may choose not to pass 5♥. After all pd did not jump to 4♥ initially.

But i have to admit, DBL and then bidding a major not neccesarilly shows another side 4 card suit. Shows a tolerance to another trump and his major is not self sufficient enough.

AQJ AQxxxx KQJ x for example, is he supposed to jump to 4♥ with this lousy suit ? Perhaps 3♥ overcall, isnt it too heavy ? I think dbl will be the choice of most people, no ?

[han]

Phil, on 2011-May-27, 09:12, said:

Takes some imagination to get to 5♥ here I think.

What do you think that the best auction by these two hands is?

Phil, on 2011-May-26, 22:25, said:

I sympathize with West's pass, but the colors are clearly wrong for converting.

East has a tricky hand to bid, but I think I would double every time with it.

[gszes]

IMPS
lho opens 3c x p
and we hold r/w

KT74
6
A972
AJ96

IMO bid 3n

w/w or r/r it is a close decision (IMPS=3n MP=p)

w/r p


Save the penalty pass for hands where our probable penalty
score is better than our probable game score or when
there is no viable alternative. This is especially true
if slam is still within the range of possibility.

Note that changing the club suit to KQ96 would change the
equation significantly because of the greatly reduced chances
of slam being made. In that case w/w or r/r I would pass at IMPS

[Phil]

han, on 2011-May-28, 12:42, said:

What do you think that the best auction by these two hands is?

Wouldn't you take 5♥ forcing? Even if its vague, it doesn't seem like a stretch to bid 5N pickaslam by West.

[whereagles]

After dbl, I'd bid 4♠ on grounds pard rates to have a shapely take out dbl, given he has quite short clubs. Now East bids 5♥ and I guess I'd pass that.

I would have overcalled 4♥ on East's hand, though.

[han]

Phil, on 2011-May-28, 15:15, said:

Wouldn't you take 5♥ forcing? Even if its vague, it doesn't seem like a stretch to bid 5N pickaslam by West.

I don't think 5H is forcing but I agree with you about 5NT.

[benlessard]

I like the X flip the M and i would bid 4M. Easy pass of 3Cx. Defending is often a safe compromise its not the best result but its a reasonable the +EV result. Sometimes we must not be too greedy and just take a fair/good result even if its not the best.

[Mbodell]

I'm pretty sure I'd bid 4♠ with either the W or the E hand. I would have been reasonably comfortable doing so with the W hand until this thread. The E hand would have felt a little awkward, but still done it.

A plausible 7♠ auction would be:

(3♣)-4♠
4nt-5♠
5nt-7♠

but 5nt 6♦-6♠ would also be quite possible (and likely what I'd bid opposite myself at the table).

[benlessard]

since im 6241 partner is approx 10 times more likely to have a 1444 than a 4144. So you will often play 4S instead of 5/6D if you bid 4S

[benlessard]

since im 6241 partner is approx 10 times more likely to have a 1444 than a 4144. So you will often play 4S instead of 5/6D if you bid 4S