BBO Discussion Forums: Is this a 1S opener? - BBO Discussion Forums

♠QJ9732
♥9
♦-
♣AT8542

I want to open this hand 1♠,but my partner think it's crazy.

Very close for me. One point light though. As I don't have a two-suited bid to show ♠ and ♣ later in the auction I would pre-empt at some level depending on the vulnerabilities.

Imps vs MP's and vulnerability really matter. I could go either way.

It's not legal to agree to open 1♠ on this hand in England: (from the orange book)

12 C One of a Suit Opening Bids
12 C 1 Minimum opening bid strength
The minimum agreement for opening one of a suit is Rule of 18, or 11 HCP. However a
partnership may not agree to open with 7 HCP or fewer even if the hand is at least
Rule of 18

That's not to say I wouldn't do it without an agreement to do so.

I really doubt this type of hand is subject to a jurisdiction's rules about "agreements" for opening bids. As a player, you either judge it to be a strange opening 1-bid, or you don't. And it certainly isn't a psyche if you open 1S.

I would be willing to discuss that point with the TD if this hand comes up for a second time in my life.

About the closest system bid I can think of is if playing multi and using 2♠ as weak two suiter. But in general, bidding systems aren't designed for freak hands. Neither are regulations. Just wing it. As partner, I would not criticize 1♠, 2♠, or pass.

I prefer both pass and 2S to 1S

Cyberyeti, on 2012-September-19, 10:21, said:

Is this sentence really talking about hands that meet Rule of 18 but do not have even 8 HCP? So, we're talking about hands with 11-cards in two suits?

This post has been edited by Bbradley62: 2012-September-19, 16:23

yunling, on 2012-September-19, 09:01, said:

It is not "crazy" to open this hand 1S, but you can outbid them later in the auction at any level since you hold the master suit and show a good two suited hand in the process. So pass and using a two suited bid later is more reasonable. Also, you can open 2♠ and have clubs as a surprise.

I would pass this hand, reverse the majors, and I would be more active and open...probably 2♥.

yunling, on 2012-September-19, 09:01, said:

It is not "crazy" to open this hand 1S, but you can outbid them later in the auction at any level since you hold the master suit and show a good two suited hand in the process. So pass and using a two suited bid later is more reasonable. Also, you can open 2♠ and have clubs as a surprise.

I would pass this hand, reverse the majors, and I would be more active and open...probably 2♥.

It helps to know the vul but I think I would usually pass and try to show my suits later.

aguahombre, on 2012-September-19, 11:28, said:

So, as a player, we each get to decide when the rules of an RA apply and when they don't?

Bbradley62, on 2012-September-19, 17:26, said:

The next poster, bill, also explained how freak hands like this are not what the regulations are about. Troll him.

I wouldn't open 1S, but those who would are allowed to choose that.

I would not open this hand 1S. If you want to open hands like this, why not consider 2 suited openings?

The good thing about passing is you have limited your hand. Now you can go nuts when the opponents start bidding, not worrying about getting hung by partner.

Conversely if you open 1♠, there are a few things that can go wrong:

1. The auction gets too high too quickly and you never get to introduce your clubs.
2. Pard doubles them in something and you haven't yet introduced your clubs - what to do? Pard may have several trump tricks when you can't make anything if you decide to take it out, or perhaps he is counting on you for a couple of defensive tricks for your opening, they make, and you had a ten card club fit all along that you could have made 5♣ in.
3. Pard insists on bidding lots and lots of red suits, holding a 13-count he assumes we can make game and trying to get out in a black suit partscore is impossible. Either you guess to pass him in a red-suit partscore or continue bidding your hand - if you pass him in a partscore he may have had a 20-count all along and you miss something, or you meekly continue bidding and end up lots down - and if you got doubled, this could have been avoided by passing, and they may open or reply 1♠ or reply 2♣, warning you out of getting into a horrible penalty.

Some example auctions of passing making it easy to show your hand, giving pard plenty of info so he won't do anything stupid:

P (1NT) P (2♦)
2♥

P (1♦) P (1♥)
1NT

P (1♥) P (2NT)
3♥

You didn't mention Vulnerability, Position, and scoring.
Check out Andrew Gumper'z second tip Better Preempts
Did you think of 3 or 4 ♠?
I will open Rule 20/22 hands 1, but this one is too weak on defense for my taste.

i think no way to answer that without more precision , but im not a 1S bidder for sure , in 3rd im pretty sure im a 3S bidder , and in first or second i will just pass , lack of value for a level 1 and my p will never be able to see that hand if i open a 2suiter opening . my very humble opinion im sure everything is acceptable but u just need to be consistent on what ur doing and just discuss with partner
sylvain

Pass.

I prefer 4S to what ever, but would go with Pass, quite often you know a lot
more if the aucion comes back to you.

With kind regards
Marlowe

The hand has too much potential for 2♠ imho. I am ok with pass, 1♠, 3♠. Even 4♠ at favorable at IMPs.

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