[thepossum]

I very nice hand but I bid it wrong and my gut feel contract went missing

---

I went minor transfer and Blackwood but etc
It took me ages to remember we had minor transfers that I forgot other possible avenues - note I had earlier forgotten we had minor transfers on another hand with long diamonds

[pescetom]

Gerber looks silly here, as it almost always is.
Opener replies 4H and now? You could be down in 4NT and you might still have a minor suit slam.

If North is GiB then 2S is a minor suit Stayman IIRC: I don't know if it has working follow ups but this would be a good moment to find out.

[thepossum]

pescetom, on 2026-January-11, 03:55, said:

Gerber looks silly here, as it almost always is.
Opener replies 4H and now? You could be down in 4NT and you might still have a minor suit slam.
If North is GiB then 2S is a minor suit Stayman: I don't know if it has working follow ups but this would be a good moment to find out.

I don't know but one of the top scores and the most elegant contract used Gerber

I don't know if it was my bidding or excess caution but I was an also ran in 6NT+1

But Gerber on this hand tells you everything you need to know. Sadly I forgot it existed

Which as something of a Gerber fan is very sad

And I did not even feel safe in 7D

I do not always go with my gut but am happy it was right here

Such a beautiful hand I spent ages trying to work out how to bid it

Maybe Gerber only worked this time by chance

But seriously knowing there is a likely grand how do you do it?

[Cyberyeti]

Gerber tells tou what you want to know if partner has 2, it tells you nothing useful if partner has 1.

1N-2N(♦)
3m-4♥(exclusion) tells you more useful info

[thepossum]

Cyberyeti, on 2026-January-11, 04:53, said:

Gerber tells tou what you want to know if partner has 2, it tells you nothing useful if partner has 1.

1N-2N(♦)
3m-4♥(exclusion) tells you more useful info

Exclusion maybe but RKCB did not give me enough to feel comfortable

I got to 3D then had not much other than RKCB - you have all the Keys
Even standard Blackwood would have worked

A couple just blasted it but sadly I let my gut down

You cannot really use quant

[pescetom]

 thepossum, on 2026-January-11, 05:03, said:

Exclusion maybe but RKCB did not give me enough to feel comfortable

Exclusion is pessimistic IMO because we won't learn about the hearts Ace which would be precious to hold. But diamonds RKCB or Gerber have the opposite problem of being ambiguous when Opener holds one Ace.

I don't have a minor Stayman over 1NT with regular partners unfortunately.

OTOH I do have 4S as a specific Ace ask, which is one option here.

But my biggest concern is not how I will check Aces but how I locate an honour fit in clubs, without which I do not want to play any grand. I don't have a way of asking for that after investigating in diamonds. So I would probably Stayman and then show clubs, hoping to be raised - if not I still impose clubs and RKCB, then decide the best contract.

[Cyberyeti]

pescetom, on 2026-January-11, 07:27, said:

Exclusion is pessimistic IMO because we won't learn about the hearts Ace which would be precious to hold. But diamonds RKCB or Gerber have the opposite problem of being ambiguous when Opener holds one Ace.

I don't have a minor Stayman over 1NT with regular partners unfortunately.

OTOH I do have 4S as a specific Ace ask, which is one option here.

But my biggest concern is not how I will check Aces but how I locate an honour fit in clubs, without which I do not want to play any grand. I don't have a way of asking for that after investigating in diamonds. So I would probably Stayman and then show clubs, hoping to be raised - if not I still impose clubs and RKCB, then decide the best contract.

It's difficult, so many varied hands will do

KQJx, Axxx, Ax, xxx is 13 off the top without a club fit

We would be in a worse place, we have several ways to bid it but none of them would be precise

[mike777]

Unfortunately you are going to need more than novice or beginner level competence to bid this slam with confidence.

Not an easy one.
For me I would start with 1NT-2NT(D)

And see if partner responds 3c or 3d(showing the Ace of D in this situation).
Not easy

Far from a Beginner problem.

[pescetom]

 Cyberyeti, on 2026-January-11, 09:04, said:

It's difficult, so many varied hands will do

KQJx, Axxx, Ax, xxx is 13 off the top without a club fit

It's a pig, at least for my methods, but I pay out cheerfully to the perfecto spades holding which is both unlikely and even harder to find.
My hope is on the clubs honour fit.

[Cyberyeti]

pescetom, on 2026-January-11, 16:18, said:

It's a pig, at least for my methods, but I pay out cheerfully to the perfecto spades holding which is both unlikely and even harder to find.
My hope is on the clubs honour fit.

I have the choice of: (well adapting my system to strong NT, actually we would open 1 of a suit playing weak which might help here)

1N-3♦ (NAT SI)

1N-2♠-2N-4♦ (6+♦-4♣ SI)

1N-2♠-2N-6♦ (Long diamonds, 4 clubs, void in one major)

♥AKQ and either J♥ or a black K will also do along with A♦

[mike777]

 Cyberyeti, on 2026-January-11, 09:04, said:

It's difficult, so many varied hands will do

KQJx, Axxx, Ax, xxx is 13 off the top without a club fit

Your example I would expect to get to the Grand, other examples perhaps not. However even with your example, not easy to bid..takes some judgement choices.

[thepossum]

Thx everyone

I'm not feeling so bad about not finding a way to bid it. At least I found 6nt+1

The easy way was standard Blackwood. Lol

Even I can count to 13

[Cyberyeti]

thepossum, on 2026-January-11, 17:11, said:

Thx everyone

I'm not feeling so bad about not finding a way to bid it. At least I found 6nt+1

The easy way was standard Blackwood. Lol

Even I can count to 13

What was the hand opposite ?

[thepossum]

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The perfect hand yet so hard to bid - and still something of a gamble on one other king

Someone cheated a bit doing transfer to clubs and RKCB

[mike777]

Tough hand, actually a very interesting deal indeed. Not easy despite 13
top tricks and all the Aces and Kings

A deal probably easier for a novice player.. fascinating

[Cyberyeti]

thepossum, on 2026-January-11, 17:27, said:

The perfect hand yet so hard to bid - and still something of a gamble on one other king

Someone cheated a bit doing transfer to clubs and RKCB

We would have a 1♦-3♥ (optional exclusion) start and not have any problem, just cue it up after, at worst we reach 7♦

Tbh 2 aces and 3 kings is a pretty heavy 1N opener, I might upgrade it but I don't have that issue.

[mike777]

 Cyberyeti, on 2026-January-11, 17:42, said:

We would have a 1♦-3♥ (optional exclusion) start and not have any problem, just cue it up after, at worst we reach 7♦

Tbh 2 aces and 3 kings is a pretty heavy 1N opener, I might upgrade it but I don't have that issue.

You certainly get on track setting trumps in the first round of bidding AND starting Keycard. Well done


I don't understand bidding your eleven card fit.
I will start the adventure with a 2+ one club and have responder start with one spade, why make it easy when there is so much room for confusion...smile

[pescetom]

thepossum said:

Someone cheated a bit doing transfer to clubs and RKCB

I would prefer Stayman then clubs, as I said. If by chance partner has 5 card spades then I can investigate controls and keycards in that suit before deciding where to play. More realistically, I get to know the length of his clubs as well as his liking (or not) for the suit.
The ideal would be some kind of SSA for clubs, but even of you play it (we don't) I doubt it works over diamonds.