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transfer responses after double (the basics)

#1 User is offline   el mister 

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Posted 2020-September-02, 10:49

Just started playing a basic transfer response structure after we open a major. If RHO doubles, or overcalls 1, is it reasonable to play an iterative one-under ladder of responses e.g. after 1 X then:
XX = spades
1 = 1N
1N = clubs
2 = diamonds
2 = solid heart raise 7-9
2 = weak heart raise

We're just starting with it so something easy to remember is good, but wasn't sure about the 1N bid - is there value in having a natural 1N there for responder? What's a typical structure here? Thanks.
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#2 User is offline   BillHiggin 

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Posted 2020-September-02, 12:39

View Postel mister, on 2020-September-02, 10:49, said:

Just started playing a basic transfer response structure after we open a major. If RHO doubles, or overcalls 1, is it reasonable to play an iterative one-under ladder of responses e.g. after 1 X then:
XX = spades
1 = 1N
1N = clubs
2 = diamonds
2 = solid heart raise 7-9
2 = weak heart raise

We're just starting with it so something easy to remember is good, but wasn't sure about the 1N bid - is there value in having a natural 1N there for responder? What's a typical structure here? Thanks.


You might find it useful to look at https://users.cs.fiu...odifiedC1MX.pdf for an existing set of agreements for this situation. They differ from you on 1S (they play that as transfer to clubs) and 1N (they play that as semi-forcing).
You must know the rules well - so that you may break them wisely!
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#3 User is offline   nige1 

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Posted 2020-September-02, 14:32

If your partnership play 4-card majors, a simple response structure is feasible:
  • 1M (X) ??
  • Pass = BAL (3 card support - if you bid again).
  • 1N = NAT N/F.
  • XX ... = TRF to next suit e.g.
  • 2M-1 = TRF 7-10 HCP 4 card support or 12+ HCP 3 card support..
  • 2M/3M/4M = PRE NAT.
  • 2N+ = ART 11+ HCP 4+ card support .
  • J/S to 2+ = SPL singleton or void 4+ raise to 3 or 5.
  • J/S to 3+ = SPL void 4+ card raise to 4.

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#4 User is offline   Vampyr 

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Posted 2020-September-02, 16:39

We keep the XX for penalty (I think you need that) and 2 is natural. We don’t have a bid to show a balanced hand 7-9 with a stopper in, presumably, the other major. Not convinced it is necessary to have that.
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#5 User is offline   miamijd 

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Posted 2020-September-02, 23:27

I think your agreement is the most common "standard expert" one here in the USA. You laid out the H sequence. The S sequence is similar, with XX being the "transfer" to 1NT (it could be a three-card spade limit raise, too).

You do NOT need XX for penalty. You just pass the double and then double when the bidding comes back around to you.

Cheers,
Mike
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#6 User is offline   el mister 

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Posted 2021-September-22, 03:50

Adding to this after playing it a while - it seems to be working ok for us. Certainly the core idea of discriminating major suit raises is massive, but we've had a few times where pard is stuck for a bid holding a natural 2N sort of hand.

e.g. 1 - 2 (overcall) to pard holding something like a balanced 10 no fit.

We don't currently have 3 defined - is it reasonable to use this bid as a catch-all invitation? Like 10+ no fit.
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#7 User is offline   paulg 

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Posted 2021-September-22, 04:47

We play 1 - (2)

Double = takeout (typically your 10+ balanced with no spade fit)
2 = simple raise (in reality this is fairly wide range)
2NT = transfer to clubs
3 = transfer to diamonds
3 = good 3+ spade raise (essentially a limit raise)
3 = mixed raise, 4+ spades, 7-9 points
3 = pre-emptive

There are trade-offs given the limited space, but we are happy to miss out on differentiating between a good and poor raise to two spades.

We also changed from distinguishing between three- and four-card limit raises to gain a mixed raise.
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I don't work for BBO and any advice is based on my BBO experience over the decades
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#8 User is offline   awm 

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Posted 2021-September-22, 06:14

I’ve always played that redouble is natural (value showing) as is 1, and transfers start with 1nt. Basically we sacrifice the natural 1nt to get better definition on hands with a long suit and on raises.

In higher auctions like 1-2 I’ve found that distinguishing between the invitational and game force raise is quite important. Opposite the invite opener will often want to jump to 4 which is great for concealment but awkward when responder has a mild slam try; also the GF raise creates a forcing pass if opponents bid more while the invite shouldn’t. This seems a lot better to me than distinguishing 3- and 4-card raises or mixed vs weak raises (mixed raise can always bid 2 and compete to 3).
Adam W. Meyerson
a.k.a. Appeal Without Merit
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