[ldrews]

Winstonm, on 2017-July-28, 17:25, said:

Here is the reason the USA Today sees as why the Russia investigation will take a long time.

Yeah, but I think the Fusion GPS case, the extensive unmasking of US Citizens by the Obama Administration staff, the Awan brothers apparent fraud and who knows what else with Debbie Wasserman and other legislators, and the alleged leaking by the FBI Counsel are more interesting stories.

And now one of the intelligence committees is calling for Special Counsel to investigate the Hillary Clinton email/Comey/Loretta Lynch episodes.

I hope you have several years supply of popcorn.

[rmnka447]

Here is link to William Browder's opening statement to the Senate Judiciary Committee during their hearing on the renewal of the FARA (Foreign Agents Registration Act).

http://www.washingto...article/2629846

It is fascinating reading.

In the follow up questioning, he was asked if the Russians would try to gain access to both campaigns and he strongly affirmed that they would. He said their objective would be to sow discord or do anything they could to weaken or compromise our system of government. So they would play both sides against the middle.

He firmly asserted that the Russian government indirectly funded a Fusion GPS smear campaign against Magnitsky and him to prevent passage of the Magnitsky act. He stated in his testimony that Fusion and a number of other Washington lobbying organizations should have been registered as agents of a foreign government under the FARA Act. But in a subsequent interview on FOX, he stated that he didn't have any knowledge about whether there were any further dealings between Russia and Fusion. Fusion GPS was working with the Dems on "opposition research" about Donald Trump during the campaign.

(Hey, Winnie, remember when I asked about possible Russian attempts to infiltrate the Clinton campaign and you vehemently denied they'd let that happen. Welcome to the real world of cloak and dagger!)

[Winstonm]

ldrews, on 2017-July-28, 19:12, said:

Yeah, but I think the Fusion GPS case, the extensive unmasking of US Citizens by the Obama Administration staff, the Awan brothers apparent fraud and who knows what else with Debbie Wasserman and other legislators, and the alleged leaking by the FBI Counsel are more interesting stories.

And now one of the intelligence committees is calling for Special Counsel to investigate the Hillary Clinton email/Comey/Loretta Lynch episodes.

I hope you have several years supply of popcorn.

Just by regurgitating the "unmasking" BS I can tell you are trolling. The rest of your post is about idiotic sideshows designed to infatuate idiots.

[Winstonm]

rmnka447, on 2017-July-28, 20:08, said:

Here is link to William Browder's opening statement to the Senate Judiciary Committee during their hearing on the renewal of the FARA (Foreign Agents Registration Act).

http://www.washingto...article/2629846

It is fascinating reading.

In the follow up questioning, he was asked if the Russians would try to gain access to both campaigns and he strongly affirmed that they would. He said their objective would be to sow discord or do anything they could to weaken or compromise our system of government. So they would play both sides against the middle.

He firmly asserted that the Russian government indirectly funded a Fusion GPS smear campaign against Magnitsky and him to prevent passage of the Magnitsky act. He stated in his testimony that Fusion and a number of other Washington lobbying organizations should have been registered as agents of a foreign government under the FARA Act. But in a subsequent interview on FOX, he stated that he didn't have any knowledge about whether there were any further dealings between Russia and Fusion. Fusion GPS was working with the Dems on "opposition research" about Donald Trump during the campaign.

(Hey, Winnie, remember when I asked about possible Russian attempts to infiltrate the Clinton campaign and you vehemently denied they'd let that happen. Welcome to the real world of cloak and dagger!)

I read this at The Atlantic.
https://www.theatlan...mmittee/534864/

[ldrews]

Winstonm, on 2017-July-28, 20:53, said:

Just by regurgitating the "unmasking" BS I can tell you are trolling. The rest of your post is about idiotic sideshows designed to infatuate idiots.

Let me regugitate this: http://www.foxnews.c...-unmasking.html

[PassedOut]

Conservative columnist George F. Will sees a bright side in the presidency of Donald J. Trump: Trump is something the nation did not know it needed

Quote

Sessions serves at the pleasure of the president, who does not seem pleased. Still, sympathy for Sessions is in order: What is he to do? If dignity concerned him, he would resign; but if it did, he would not occupy a Trump-bestowed office from which to resign. Such are the conundrums of current politics. Concerning which, there is excessive gloom.

“To see what is in front of one’s nose,” George Orwell wrote, “needs a constant struggle.” An unnoticed reason for cheerfulness is that in one, if only one, particular, Trump is something the nation did not know it needed: a feeble president whose manner can cure the nation’s excessive fixation with the presidency.

Still, it's hard to forget that Will is the columnist who "bet his reputation" on a landslide Romney victory -- with Romney carrying even Minnesota -- just before Romney's unsurprising loss to Obama. Maybe, though, Trump's incompetence and feebleness will indeed force a more bipartisan congress, as we saw this week when both democrats and republicans worked together to stop the Trumpcare bill in the senate.

[PassedOut]

duplicate

[Winstonm]

https://www.usatoday...zens/100026368/

A factual description of the unmasking process.

[Winstonm]

WaPo reports about the Fusion GPS/Steele dossier:

Quote

Fusion GPS has said that it was working for the law firm BakerHostetler, which was representing Prevezon, a Russian holding company based in Cyprus, in its defense against Justice Department allegations that Prevezon laundered money stolen in the fraud Magnitsky uncovered. Veselnitskaya was Prevezon’s lawyer. Fusion GPS started working on the case in 2013 and the case settled in May with no admission of guilt by Prevezon.

Fusion GPS told me its work on the Prevezon case had nothing to do with the 2016 presidential election and they were not involved in the outreach to the Trump campaign.

“Fusion GPS learned about this meeting from news reports and had no prior knowledge of it,” the company told me in a statement. “Any claim that Fusion GPS arranged or facilitated this meeting in any way is false.”

As a subcontractor for BakerHostetler, Fusion GPS would not have been required to register under FARA. Senators may want to know why BakerHostetler decided that it did not need to register. Neither Veselnitskaya nor Mark Cymrot of BakerHostetler, who handled the Prevezon case, responded to requests for comment.


Regardless, senators on the committee may now use the FARA hearing to press Justice Department officials on what they know about Veselnitskaya, Prevezon, Fusion GPS and their connections to both the Trump campaign or the Russian government.

Prevezon is owned by Russian businessman Denis Katsyv. His father, Pyotr Katsyv, was vice premier and minister of transport of Moscow region from 2004 to 2012. Katsyv’s deputy minister was Alexander Mitusov, Veselnitskaya’s ex husband.

Fusion GPS began its separate work on the Trump-Russia connections in October 2015, working for unnamed Republican clients. After Trump won the primary, Democratic funders continued to push the effort. Christopher Steele, the former MI6 officer who compiled the dossier, was brought on in May 2016.

There’s no evidence that the work Fusion GPS did for BakerHostetler on behalf of Prevezon and their work on the Trump dossier were connected. In fact, the former seems to advance Russian interests while the latter is hugely problematic for the Russian government. It’s entirely possible that the firm was working on two separate Russia-related projects for clients who had opposing interests, roughly at the same time.

If the Trump team continues to allege the two cases are related, the congressional and perhaps federal inquiries into the firm could be just getting started. And Veselnitskaya’s meeting with Donald Trump Jr. is not mentioned in the dossier the firm produced for its American political clients.

[ldrews]

Winstonm, on 2017-July-29, 09:59, said:

WaPo reports about the Fusion GPS/Steele dossier:

I no longer consider the Washington Post a reliable source of news.

[Winstonm]

ldrews, on 2017-July-29, 10:23, said:

I no longer consider the Washington Post a reliable source of news.

What a coincidence. I was thinking the same about you.

[mike777]

I know very little of this whole Fusion issue.
What little I have read, if accurate, is this issue focuses on cofounder Glenn Simpson. He is happy to answer questions to Congress except one. He will not appear on a voluntary basis if he is asked who hired him to dig up issues on Mr. Trump. It was reported Democrats are going to the mat for him over this issue.
In any event whatever the true facts of the issue are I hope Robert Mueller looks into it.

[Winstonm]

mike777, on 2017-July-29, 12:51, said:

I know very little of this whole Fusion issue.
What little I have read, if accurate, is this issue focuses on cofounder Glenn Simpson. He is happy to answer questions to Congress except one. He will not appear on a voluntary basis if he is asked who hired him to dig up issues on Mr. Trump. It was reported Democrats are going to the mat for him over this issue.
In any event whatever the true facts of the issue are I hope Robert Mueller looks into it.

You must have poor sources to read as it is easily found that Fusion was first hired by the Republicans until Trump won the nomination at which point the company was hired by the Democrats to continue to dig up dirt on Trump.
This is from Politico: (emphasis added)

Quote

Simpson hired Steele, a Russia expert, during the GOP primary and Steele continued his work after Trump was picked as the nominee. In its 35 pages was a seamy tale of a years-long conspiracy by the Kremlin to recruit Trump as an ally, to blackmail him through business deals and to entrap him in acts of sexual misconduct.

The issue I've read is the claim that Simpson also was hired to lobby for Russian interests unrelated to the Steele dossier but he claims he was working for an attorney and was not lobbying.

[mike777]

Ya, I think the articles mentioned that his firm often uses cutouts/lawyers to hide who is behind the hire. Anyway it does seem the firm and this guy does have deep deep Democratic party ties going back years, even the lawyers who hire him have a long history of working for the party.


In any event I barely have heard about this whole issue, sounds like you guys have been at it for a while.

[ldrews]

Winstonm, on 2017-July-29, 11:20, said:

What a coincidence. I was thinking the same about you.

But then I never professed to be one.

[rmnka447]

Winstonm, on 2017-July-29, 09:59, said:

WaPo reports about the Fusion GPS/Steele dossier:

Winnie, Winnie, Winnie, there you go again. You present a piece from a biased source as authoritative. The only problem is that it isn't.

The Washington Post states:

Quote

There's no evidence that the work Fusion GPS did for BakerHofstetler on behalf of Prevezon and their work on the Trump dossier were connected. In fact, the former seems to advance Russian interests while the latter is highly problematic for the Russian government. It's entirely possible that the firm was working on two separate Russian-related projects for clients who had opposing interest, roughly at the same time.

This isn't fact, it's conjecture. The summation in the third sentence starts "It's entirely possible" which are weasel words and no where near something like "It's absolutely certain". Furthermore, there's no way to know if there's no connection between the work for Prevezon and the Trump dossier without a thorough investigation. There's no way the Washington Post has the necessary tools to even do that.

Also, the second sentence makes an unwarranted assumption that the Russian wouldn't do anything that might make themselves look bad. But if Russia's overarching goal is to weaken the US by fostering chaos, discord, and division among Americans and between Americans and the American Government, then the Russians might well do something that casts themselves in a bad light if it progresses their main objective.

What is known is that Prevezon has connections to the Russian government when its owner's father is a confidant and close friend of Putin (according to William Browder's testimony). It is also known that Fusion GPS did work for Prevezon. According to William Browder, it was a completely bogus smear campaign against Magnitsky and himself.

What's not known is if somehow in the course of doing business with Prevezon, Fusion GPS did something that compromised themselves with the Russians.

So the best you can say about this piece is that it provides a few facts, but is really an opinion.

I would refer you to view the Browder testimony. It's available on-line at www.c-span.org . Parts of his testimony are definitely his opinion, but some of what he said about the Russians and how they operate is downright scary.

[Winstonm]

rmnka447, on 2017-July-29, 21:30, said:

Winnie, Winnie, Winnie, there you go again. You present a piece from a biased source as authoritative. The only problem is that it isn't.

The Washington Post states:



This isn't fact, it's conjecture. The summation in the third sentence starts "It's entirely possible" which are weasel words and no where near something like "It's absolutely certain". Furthermore, there's no way to know if there's no connection between the work for Prevezon and the Trump dossier without a thorough investigation. There's no way the Washington Post has the necessary tools to even do that.

Also, the second sentence makes an unwarranted assumption that the Russian wouldn't do anything that might make themselves look bad. But if Russia's overarching goal is to weaken the US by fostering chaos, discord, and division among Americans and between Americans and the American Government, then the Russians might well do something that casts themselves in a bad light if it progresses their main objective.

What is known is that Prevezon has connections to the Russian government when its owner's father is a confidant and close friend of Putin (according to William Browder's testimony). It is also known that Fusion GPS did work for Prevezon. According to William Browder, it was a completely bogus smear campaign against Magnitsky and himself.

What's not known is if somehow in the course of doing business with Prevezon, Fusion GPS did something that compromised themselves with the Russians.

So the best you can say about this piece is that it provides a few facts, but is really an opinion.

I would refer you to view the Browder testimony. It's available on-line at www.c-span.org . Parts of his testimony are definitely his opinion, but some of what he said about the Russians and how they operate is downright scary.

I read the Browder testimony a number of days ago. It is eye-opening for sure. The big question to answer concerning Simpson is whether or not he personally lobbied for Russian interests and so far nothing confirms that. I have no problem with Congress investigating non-disclosure for FARA purposes, but that should include Flynn, Manafort, and anyone else who lobbied for a foreign government. This is not a time for partisanship finger-pointing. Russia is the mutual enemy of both the right and left. Most of Congress seems to understand this; it would be nice if the executive branch knew it, too.

As for sources, let's be clear: if you think the major newspapers that still have investigative reporters are not reliable there is nothing to discuss.

[ldrews]

Winstonm, on 2017-July-30, 09:47, said:

As for sources, let's be clear: if you think the major newspapers that still have investigative reporters are not reliable there is nothing to discuss.

Then there is nothing to discuss.

[Zelandakh]

ldrews, on 2017-July-30, 12:00, said:

Then there is nothing to discuss.

If only it were this simple to get rid of trolls.

[ldrews]

Zelandakh, on 2017-July-30, 16:10, said:

If only it were this simple to get rid of trolls.

If you went away wouldn't there be one less?