[The Casual]

http://tinyurl.com/q8nqmdg

Ignore the bidding, we weren't 100% sure what was happening ourselves. How should N go about bidding his hand? They didn't want to open 2♣ and lie about having a 5 cd suit, or rebid 2NT (22-24) with the singleton. Also, after the 1♣ opening p wasn't happy bidding NT without some explicit bid by me showing a stopper in ♦; I argued that the 1NT bid more or less implies at least something in diamonds and it is relatively safe to bid 3NT, but they weren't convinced.

[mike777]

4441 strong hands common problem hand, no perfect solution.

Prefer to start with 2c.


2c=2d(random a or k/gf)
2nt=3nt
p

note easy to miss 6 of minor.

[Zelandakh]

Things go a lot more smoothly if South responds 1♦. On this side of The Pond the norm for 1NT over 1♣ is 8-10 , at least as I learned it.

There are lots of specialist solutions around for strong 4441 hands. Without playing one of those, the most common solutions are to open 1 of a minor and trust partner to keep the bidding open on any excuse or to treat the hand as balanced. On hands where neither of these are suitable you just have to treat one of the suits as 5 in length but there is generally disagreement about which suit to choose when polls on sample hands are run here, especially if the heart suit is very strong and the minor(s) quite weak.

[ahydra]

Got to start with 2C on this 24-count. After this we have a gadget available to show strong 4441 (and South just bids 3NT), but failing that you just bid 2NT as Mike suggested.

ahydra

[ArtK78]

Yes, this hand is very uncomfortable for North unless you have special methods to deal with strong 4441 hands.

I would treat this hand as balanced and open 2♣ intending to rebid 2NT. 24 HCP is just too much to open 1 of a suit (unless it is forcing like in Fantunes). Mentally move one of your spot cards in a 4 card suit into diamonds and treat the hand as a 4432 24 count.

Getting to 6♣, which appears at first glance to be the right contract, may be too much to ask in any Standard system. Given that the clubs break 5-0 that is a blessing in disguise. Even with good breaks, the hand is tricky to play in 6♣.

[The Casual]

Thanks for the responses. I didn't really have a problem with p opening in 1x with the high point count because I saw it was an awkward hand, and that they were trying to make the auction more comfortable (unfortunately I made the only bid that gives them problems), but I realise now with 24 points there is a risk of missing a solid game. I think opening 2♣ and rebidding 2NT is an adequate work around; I'll see what they think.