[bd71]

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Matchpoints. Standard 2/1. No specific discussion or agreement on what the 3♥ jump shows.

Do you agree with temporarily hiding heart support with the 1♠ bid?

Are you interested in slam or satisfied with game? How would you pursue slam?

[SteveMoe]

Game for me. 4♥ is enough. Suspect partner is 15-16 and 1=6=3=3 or similar. Cannot predict enough cover cards to make 12 tricks in ♥ a sure thing. ♠x ♥AQJxxx ♦KQx ♣KJx perhaps.

[Codo]

Partner announced real strong hearts, so I am surely looking for a slam. Unluckily, 3 ♠ would not show heart support with a spade control, so I need to bid 4 ♦. If partner can bid more then 4 ♥ over this, we just need enough KCs to make slam.

[the_clown]

4♥. I am worried that after 4♦, partner will show his club control 100% of the time and we may be too high.
I could try a clever 4♣ and bid slam if partner denies a ♦ control. This also has the advantage that partner will also move afer 4♣-♦-4♥ with a real strong hand. On the other hand he may misevaluate his hand based on the false information, or he may have not have a club control as well. I still think pass is right, but If I bid, I would much rather bid 4♣

[P_Marlowe]

Hiding the support is ok, as long as you play a change of suit, at least on the 1 level as
forcing.
Without prior discussion a risky assumption, but if you are from the same area, and everyone
even the lonely dog on the street plays it as forcing, hiding the support is enough.

The next question is, is 3H forcing, if 1S was forcing, than 2H would have shown nothing, but
3H maybe just inv. strength.

I would give up on slam, possibly paying off due to a lack of agreement set, but will reach a
reasonale contract.

With kind regards
Marlowe

[Cyberyeti]

What would (1♦)-1♥-P-2♠ be for you ?

[ahydra]

Cyberyeti, on 2013-April-24, 04:29, said:

What would (1♦)-1♥-P-2♠ be for you ?

My thoughts exactly - I play that as a fit jump and would probably make that bid here.

Given the auction so far I can't really decide whether to try for slam or not, so it's probably best not to risk it. For example, what is 2D instead of 3H? Is 1S forcing?

ahydra

[bd71]

Cyberyeti, on 2013-April-24, 04:29, said:

What would (1♦)-1♥-P-2♠ be for you ?

Not a fit-jump in our agreements...weak jump shift instead. Completely understand that fit-jumps in competition are superior, but we simply havne't gone there yet.

[Zelandakh]

Assuming our 1♠ advance was forcing, the jump rebid in hearts should show extras but not enough for game. That means something like 12-14. With the 15-16 point hand Steve proposes, partner could cue bid first to establish a game force. So 4♥ is enough.

[bd71]

ahydra, on 2013-April-24, 05:00, said:

My thoughts exactly - I play that as a fit jump and would probably make that bid here.

Given the auction so far I can't really decide whether to try for slam or not, so it's probably best not to risk it. For example, what is 2D instead of 3H? Is 1S forcing?

ahydra

1♠ was NOT forcing. (Note: this line was edited 2-3 minutes after initially posted where I accidentally suggested the opposite.)

2♦ instead of 3♥ would be generic forcing bid, not necessarily showing ♠ support, and likely suggesting his strength is upper range for hand that didn't double-then-bid (so he likely maxes out around 16 points or playing-stength equivalent).

It's this latter point -- the fact that his hand is capped by failure to double initially -- that caused me to simply bid 4♥. But the very good player sitting East suggested that he would have explored slam.

[Codo]

Zelandakh, on 2013-April-24, 05:10, said:

Assuming our 1♠ advance was forcing, the jump rebid in hearts should show extras but not enough for game. That means something like 12-14. With the 15-16 point hand Steve proposes, partner could cue bid first to establish a game force. So 4♥ is enough.

So he must game force with say xx,AKQxxx,xxx,Ax? What about Qx,AKQxxx,xxx,Kx?

I very often agree with your bidding approach, but surely not here...

[Zelandakh]

No, the first hand especially is certainly a 3♥ rebid. The problem is that if you reverse the minor suit holdings then we have no 5 level safety and we do not have the space for this. It is quite possible that slam is making; indeed I would wager that it did make on the OP hand. Otherwise it would not have been posted. I just think that the odds do not favour pushing for it when we hold a minimum and need something specific from partner with no way of finding out in safety. But that is a judgement issue and I am open to being persuaded otherwise. I posted primarily to give my interpretation of the bidding sequence, since it was different to Steve, who I usually agree with on such matters. As an aside, I very often agree with your bidding approach too and have often thought that you are the most similar in style to me of the regular BBF posters.

Edit: I posted this before bd71's edit. Obviously when 1♠ is not forcing we can afford to show slam willingness. There are dangers in this too but now we are very much top end and I think it is worth showing that.

[rogerclee]

bd71, on 2013-April-24, 05:05, said:

Not a fit-jump in our agreements...weak jump shift instead. Completely understand that fit-jumps in competition are superior, but we simply havne't gone there yet.

I play 2S would be natural and forcing fwiw. Every convention that shows a specific handtype is good when it comes up, it's not that important what your agreements are in a situation like this as long as you both know them.

1) 1S is obvious, spades will usually play better than hearts on a hand like this anytime partner has a doubleton (or singleton Q). On top of this it has lead directional value and is generally a more accurate description than 2D.
2) I like 4D but I think it's close, and 4H is fine. Thinking through his handtypes, 1633 is the shape where slam is usually bad, if he has 2 spades and/or 7 hearts and a good hand I like my chances.

Edit: Just saw 1S is not forcing, that makes 4D obvious to me. We have pretty much literally a maximum hand for hearts given the previous action.