[onoway]

Both my desktop and laptop have developed odd habits which revolve around "hanging" for ages and consistently telling me that a web page link is broken when it isn't and so forth. Took the desktop in and they supposedly cleaned it of everything..both are defragged and so forth regularly. So time for new ones it seems, as waiting for 2 minutes for a page to load gets very old.

How do I prevent the same things happening to the new ones? and are there any brands I should avoid? I don't know much more about computers than the very very basics..not even sure what most of the stuff means when places describe their different computers. Any suggestions would be very much appreciated. and btw..anyone have any experience buying from TigerDirect?if so, good? bad?

[blackshoe]

Are all your applications up to date? Is your OS up to date? Those are things I'd look at before looking at a new machine. OTOH, if you have a very old machine (say 4 years or more), your problem may be in the hardware.

If you're going to get a new machine, it may be time to look at alternatives to Windows, which I gather is what you're running now. Macs are perceived as more expensive, but a lot of things you'd have to buy "extra" on a Windows box are included in the Mac's price. Just make sure you're comparing apples to apples. There's also various flavors of Linux, but if you're not very computer literate, that's probably not for you.

I'm a bit biased. I've hated Windows since I had to deal with it at work 25 years or so ago (Windows 1.0). I've always favored Macs; I find them easier to use and to understand — and so do many who've switched from Windows to Mac. All that said, current versions of Windows aren't terrible, so if you want to stick with what you know, go for it.

Back to software for a moment, cleaning out your browser's cache periodically, and dumping old and no longer needed mail are two things that can help.

I don't know much about brands other than Apple — I do have a Dell laptop, which is now at least 8 years old and still reliable, but I don't use it for much. HP has always been a good brand for me - I buy their printers. As for Tiger Direct, afaik they have a pretty good reputation. Or had, I haven't really looked into that kind of thing in a while.

[brian_m]

onoway, on 2011-November-23, 21:48, said:

Both my desktop and laptop have developed odd habits which revolve around "hanging" for ages and consistently telling me that a web page link is broken when it isn't and so forth. Took the desktop in and they supposedly cleaned it of everything..both are defragged and so forth regularly. So time for new ones it seems, as waiting for 2 minutes for a page to load gets very old.

How do I prevent the same things happening to the new ones? and are there any brands I should avoid? I don't know much more about computers than the very very basics..not even sure what most of the stuff means when places describe their different computers. Any suggestions would be very much appreciated. and btw..anyone have any experience buying from TigerDirect?if so, good? bad?

Before you buy a new computer, I would have someone who knows what they're doing take a close look at your internet connection. If you're on a lousy connection, then buying a new computer is going to contribute precisely zero towards sorting the problem. I see a fair amount of hangs here too, but I know full well that it's down to the crappy satellite connection which is the only internet service available to me, and has nothing whatsoever to do with my PC. Do you see the hangs when doing something which doesn't involve using the internet?


P.S. "Someone who knows what they're doing" does NOT mean calling your ISP's technical support people. Unless it's a small ISP, you'll end up talking to a level 1 "script monkey" whose primary concern will be to absolve his employers of all possible blame, and you don't have the computer knowledge to get past them to someone who knows what they're talking about. You need someone independent of your ISP to check out your connection.

This post has been edited by brian_m: 2011-November-23, 23:04

[JLOGIC]

Don't look at porn from unsafe sites!

[kenberg]

We have two laptops and a desktop. My computer literacy is limited, although not exactly zero.


My wife's laptop (or notebook, I don't know the difference), maybe three years old, was driving her crazy with its slow internet action. The manufacturer, I suppose with the best of intentions, had some sort of healthcheck program that would decide it had to do a check. We have virus protection and it did not seem like the original healthchecker was doing much good so I uninstalled it. (It had some peculiarities of its own that made it pretty worthless anyway.) This cleared up matters a fair amount. I think the other issue is that she uses it upstairs (second floor), connecting via router to the cable connection in the basement. A classier router would probably help.

The newest one is my laptop, an Inspiron from Dell with Windows 7. It has some, or perhaps developed some, very eccentric features. I'll be typing away and suddenly the computer erases the last several lines of what I have written and places the cursor in the middle of a previous paragraph. Or, and this is more recent, it closes the program I am working on. In exasperation I went online and found out how to post a problem to a forum that Dell has. I received a reply with several suggestions and a willingness to follow up if these ideas did not work. This was just a few days ago and what with Thanksgiving (we have company today and more company tomorrow) I have not had time yet to try it out. But you might see if such a forum exists.

Before I retired I used Unix a lot and then Linnux. Yes they are good but there was onsite help as I needed it (I needed it). I second the recommendation that you stick with Windows or a Mac. I have found Dell to be a nice company to deal with and the response to my problem above seems typical of their service. That is, the bad news is that I do have some sort of issue, the good news is that they are willing to help. I probably won't need a new computer for a while, but when I do, I would probably just get another from Dell. I don't claim you can't do better, but I think you can do pretty well with them without thinking a lot about it, and that suits me.

By the way, have you tried taking your laptop to some WiFi pace like Starbucks or a library to see how the slowly internet hookups work there?

[onoway]

Talked to the provider people..I have high speed supposedly, and they replaced all the phone wire between where it comes into the house and the jacks, gave me a new modem and wire for inside the house as well. OTOH when I tried it in the shop for about half an hour or so it worked way faster. Very occassionally tho everything seems to work faster here too so that may have been circumstance. One thing that may have given both of them heartburn is that the power goes out ( not just my house!) about once a month, sometimes for a moment or two sometimes for longer. I have them on a surge protector but someone said those don't help much, I should have a built in battery arrangement that would automatically kick in when the power goes out. I don't remember ever seeing this offered.

I have no idea what browser cache is much less how to empty it..I clean out unnecessary files, is that the same thing? Probably could dump a lot of email..it's become sort of like a diary so haven't done anything with a lot of it. It is getting pretty big but the available space on both machines shows well over 50% the desktop in the 80% range. OTOH I keep getting messages on the laptop that it's low on virtual memory and Windows is doing something about it so that may be the problem for the laptop? What can be done about that and why is it saying that when it shows as 58% space available after it's defragged?

Both machines are getting on in years. The desktop was bought refurbished about 7 years ago and the laptop was bought new about 8 years ago DT is HP and laptop is Toshiba. The laptop has had a bit of a hard life . So neither really owes me anything I just hate to toss things out if they are still viable.

It would be lovely to have an Apple but they're pretty pricey..the refurbished ones that Amazon sells might be an option. May have to go try to figure out what the different ones are. Right now I am seriously considering a toshiba from Tiger Direct, one of the priorities for a laptop is a big screen which makes being on it for a while a lot easier on the eyes.

Ken: my desktop suddenly had the cursor darting about the screen or sometimes disappearing entirely even when I changed the mouse to a new one.(that was the final straw that sent it to the shop). They couldn't find anything wrong with it but when I carted it home again it started up again. So I tried using a different connection spot on computer for the mouse and the problem instantly disappeared and hasn't reappeared. So that might be something you could try..I had gone to some computer forums and not one person had suggested that, although it seems to be relatively common problem. Perhaps it is too obvious to bear mentioning but it would have been helpful!

Thanks for the input. And if I want to know about safe porn sites, now I know who to ask

[blackshoe]

kenberg, on 2011-November-24, 06:44, said:

My wife's laptop (or notebook, I don't know the difference)...

This wikipedia page should explain it.

[gwnn]

blackshoe, on 2011-November-24, 08:05, said:

This wikipedia page should explain it.

Except it doesn't It has "notebook" on the top of the page as a synonym for laptop. The section you point to only speaks about netbooks.

I think there was a point some time in the mid to late 90's when people started to use notebook as a more modern word for laptop, supposedly trying to imply a faster machine. Then slowly it fell into disuse (albeit not completely). I might be wrong about this, though.

[blackshoe]

onoway, on 2011-November-24, 06:47, said:

I should have a built in battery arrangement that would automatically kick in when the power goes out. I don't remember ever seeing this offered.

Uninterruptible power supplies are highly recommended in your power situation. APC makes good ones, and provides a guide to help you pick the right size for your needs.

onoway, on 2011-November-24, 06:47, said:

I have no idea what browser cache is much less how to empty it..I clean out unnecessary files, is that the same thing? Probably could dump a lot of email..it's become sort of like a diary so haven't done anything with a lot of it. It is getting pretty big but the available space on both machines shows well over 50% the desktop in the 80% range.

Browser cache is where your browser stores web pages you visit on your hard drive, so that if you visit them again, the browser loads from the cache rather than from the internet, saving you the time of going through the "download the page from the internet" again. It has limited hard drive space, and when that gets close to full, the browser has to spend extra time figuring out which old pages to get rid of. Deleting the cache doesn't alway help, but it never hurts (well, except that for a while all pages you visit will be downloaded from the 'net). How to delete the cache varies from browser to browser, and I don't remember how to do it in IE. Sorry.

Your email program can have a similar problem. When you have a lot of mail, it sometimes takes the program a while to sort through it, doing whatever it's doing. Getting rid of old mail can help. If you really want to keep an archive copy, you can export old mail to a text file.

onoway, on 2011-November-24, 06:47, said:

Both machines are getting on in years. The desktop was bought refurbished about 7 years ago and the laptop was bought new about 8 years ago DT is HP and laptop is Toshiba. The laptop has had a bit of a hard life . So neither really owes me anything I just hate to toss things out if they are still viable.

It would be lovely to have an Apple but they're pretty pricey..the refurbished ones that Amazon sells might be an option. May have to go try to figure out what the different ones are. Right now I am seriously considering a toshiba from Tiger Direct, one of the priorities for a laptop is a big screen which makes being on it for a while a lot easier on the eyes.

The current life cycle for computer hardware is about 18 months. That doesn't mean your machines are obsolete, but they are definitely obsolescent. Yes, Apple's products are pricey, relatively speaking, but IMO they're worth it. YMMV, of course. I have an iMac and I love it. I used to own a Mac mini (in fact, I had one, then upgraded to a newer one). They start at 600 bucks new. You'll need a keyboard, mouse, and monitor, but you may be able to use your existing stuff. BTW, lot of useful links on that apple page for folks looking to buy or switch from windows. OTOH, the Toshiba laptops aren't bad.

onoway, on 2011-November-24, 06:47, said:

Ken: my desktop suddenly had the cursor darting about the screen or sometimes disappearing entirely even when I changed the mouse to a new one.(that was the final straw that sent it to the shop). They couldn't find anything wrong with it but when I carted it home again it started up again. So I tried using a different connection spot on computer for the mouse and the problem instantly disappeared and hasn't reappeared. So that might be something you could try..I had gone to some computer forums and not one person had suggested that, although it seems to be relatively common problem. Perhaps it is too obvious to bear mentioning but it would have been helpful!

I've had similar problems to Ken's on my windows laptop. It's not a mouse thing - I use the built-in trackpad. I think it's an OS bug that Microsloth has been unable to find in the last ten years or so.

[blackshoe]

gwnn, on 2011-November-24, 08:50, said:

Except it doesn't It has "notebook" on the top of the page as a synonym for laptop. The section you point to only speaks about netbooks.

I think there was a point some time in the mid to late 90's when people started to use notebook as a more modern word for laptop, supposedly trying to imply a faster machine. Then slowly it fell into disuse (albeit not completely). I might be wrong about this, though.

Perhaps you should read it again. And check the first reference link, which is to an online dictionary definition of "notebook computer".

Bottom line: there isn't much difference between "laptop" and "notebook". Notebooks are low end (particularly in size) "laptops".

The MacBook Pro has three screen sizes: 13, 15, and 17 inch. I suppose the 13" is a "notebook", the other two aren't. The MacBook Air has 11 and 13 inch screen sizes. Both are "notebooks" IMO.

[kenberg]

Notebook/laptop is one of those distinctions that I don't need to resolve. When I first got the Inspiron I figured its small size precluded spacehogs such as Mathematica but I had reasons for wanting M on something portable so I tried it and it works fine. I know there are even hoggier apps but I so far have no use for them. (Richard: Yes, I also run Matlab on it , and by the way, welcome back. Couldn't stay away from the fish I see.)

Pam, this business about storage capacity has caused me troubles as well. You would think that 80% leaves plenty of room, but with previous computers I have found them slowing down somewhere around there, maybe even earlier.

As for price, Monday is cybermonday, right? And for not too much you should be able to get something that outpaces an older machine by quite a bit. It depends on your enthusiasms. I have yet to learn to tweet, I rarely use facebook, someone recently did something for me with SurveyMonkey or some such thing that I don't know much about, but I do like to have a computer that comes up when I ask it to and goes to the sites that I want it to w/o me having to make coffee while it thinks about whether or not it wants to comply. I have to get a better router though because sometimes I lose touch on BBO unless I am on the desktop.

[blackshoe]

I note that on apple's website, they call all the MacBooks "notebooks". <shrug>

Twenty percent of a 60 GB drive is 1.2 GB. Most personal computer operating systems need at least 2 GB of contiguous space, IIRC.

Ken: what router do you have?

[Zelandakh]

Do you have anti-virus software installed? Very often this can seem to act like a virus itself and will make the computer run unusably slowly.

Are you certain that just because the ISP say you have super-fast broadband that you actually do? It is usually reported that less than half of users actually get the download speeds that are advertised, often alot less than half.

Is your network set-up correctly? Networks are not really my area and are notoriously difficult to find problems in. That is why most ISPs will not provide any support for them. You can cast an eye around the settings here but you probably need an expert to sort it out if there are any issues. Sometimes a single setting can massively change the performance - I had this myself once too.

Do you know the processes that run on your PC? When I buy a PC one of the first things I do is open Task Manager and make a note of what is running. Anytime there are issues I check the process list and see if anything has changed - if there is something then that is often the cause of the problem. This does not have to be malware, as above the virus scanner is a common cause for such issues but also things you have chosen to install or windows services such as Updater can produce significant performance hits.
Are you using a wired or wireless connection? Despite the hype wireless is not without significant problems. Performance is well below that of a good wired connection and you are more open to service disruption and hacking. If you are using wireless then I would recommend trying a wired connection for a while to see if anything changes.
Related to the above, have you installed any rubbish? You said that you had a clean install done so this should not really apply to you but over time lots of small add-ons and utilities tend to find their way onto computers. These can cause significant slowdowns so it is always advisable to remove anything that you do not need and not to install new things unnecessarily. Quite often an uninstall is not able to successfully remove everything that it added.

Have you checked your registry? This is one to try only if you feel comfortable with it. Do not change anything in the registry unless you know what you are doing and ideally with a back-up available. There are certain places to look for malware which are good to be aware of. The first is Microsoft-Windows-CurrentVersion-Run (sorry not to give a full path here but I am at work and do not have access). This is the section where things are selected for running at boot-up (such as utilities for your graphics card and always-on software). You should know EVERYTHING that is referenced in this section. Anything you are unsure of, type the filename into Google and check that the results match the file location. This is the most common location for viruses to install themselves into. The second place is under BrowserHelperObjects. Again I cannot give you a proper path but there is only one location that matches if you run a search. A few more advanced malware programs hide themselves here. This section is not always easy to interpret so you should probably not bother unless you are very PC-literate other than to note what is already installed.

Finally, to remove temporary files you can just open internet options, either through Control Panel or from Internet Explorer itself. This is the third common place where malware hides itself. There is also a windows temporary folder in, I think, the top level windows directory. You can clear some old relics out of here too but it is only rarely a haven for malware or other problems.

Good luck with it - I doubt very much you need a new computer only for browsing-style activities. More likely there is a problem with your connection, either directly, on your network, or within your computer. You may be able to find something yourself, you might need professional help. But unless you have another reason for needing a new computer then I would tend to agree with the poster that suggested having someone look before buying would be a good idea. Do check yourself first though and make notes of everything you did - if nothing else this might save the professional some time in tracking down something.

[paulg]

Older systems often have inadequate memory configurations, especially if you have upgraded the operating system on it. If your desktop and/or laptop has less than 1GB physical memory (RAM) then it might be cheap to upgrade this and you'd probably notice a big difference. Sites like http://www.crucial.com/ can help you analyse and cost memory upgrades.

[kenberg]

blackshoe, on 2011-November-24, 09:36, said:

Ken: what router do you have?

Netgear WGR614

There are some heating/ac ducts between the router and the laptop although the distance is not large. 30 feet, maybe, as the crow flies (if he could fly through ducts).

Most of the time it's fine, but every once in a while there is an issue so really when I play on BBO I should go down to the basement. Far from coffee, cheese, spouse, etc. (Listing is not to be construed by spouse as order of importance).

[blackshoe]

I would think that whatever problem the ducting presents, if any, it's always there, so if there's a slowdown, it's probably something else. Netgear makes pretty good stuff, so it's unlikely to be just "it's crap gear". I'd make sure you have the latest firmware installed.

[kenberg]

firmware? Is that stuff I would get, in this case, from Netgear? The firm?

[onoway]

paulg, on 2011-November-24, 09:57, said:

Older systems often have inadequate memory configurations, especially if you have upgraded the operating system on it. If your desktop and/or laptop has less than 1GB physical memory (RAM) then it might be cheap to upgrade this and you'd probably notice a big difference. Sites like http://www.crucial.com/ can help you analyse and cost memory upgrades.

WOW. I went to the link and it tells me that although the laptop can hold up to 2 GB of memory it currently only has 768 mg. And if I have only 50% of that left...so it makes sense to start there! Now I have to figure out how to get the links of my favorites file onto something to save as many of them are older and impossible to track down through the noise and reverberating echo of search engine results. This looks promising for this geriatric laptop at least, as 1 GB of memory is about $45- a whole lot cheaper than a new computer! I'm not so sure about the desktop, I think it has lurkers somewhere. Thank you!

[PassedOut]

blackshoe, on 2011-November-24, 09:08, said:

Uninterruptible power supplies are highly recommended in your power situation. APC makes good ones, and provides a guide to help you pick the right size for your needs.

We have to deal with short outages now and then during winter and, as Blackshoe says, have found the APS products very reliable. Via a USB connection, the UPS will shut down your computer automatically and gracefully when the power goes out even when you are away. The battery keeps the computer running during the shutdown even though the power has gone down -- especially useful if you don't have an auxiliary generator.

[onoway]

Zelandakh, on 2011-November-24, 09:46, said:

Do you have anti-virus software installed? Very often this can seem to act like a virus itself and will make the computer run unusably slowly.

Are you certain that just because the ISP say you have super-fast broadband that you actually do? It is usually reported that less than half of users actually get the download speeds that are advertised, often alot less than half.

Is your network set-up correctly? Networks are not really my area and are notoriously difficult to find problems in. That is why most ISPs will not provide any support for them. You can cast an eye around the settings here but you probably need an expert to sort it out if there are any issues. Sometimes a single setting can massively change the performance - I had this myself once too.

Do you know the processes that run on your PC? When I buy a PC one of the first things I do is open Task Manager and make a note of what is running. Anytime there are issues I check the process list and see if anything has changed - if there is something then that is often the cause of the problem. This does not have to be malware, as above the virus scanner is a common cause for such issues but also things you have chosen to install or windows services such as Updater can produce significant performance hits.
Are you using a wired or wireless connection? Despite the hype wireless is not without significant problems. Performance is well below that of a good wired connection and you are more open to service disruption and hacking. If you are using wireless then I would recommend trying a wired connection for a while to see if anything changes.
Related to the above, have you installed any rubbish? You said that you had a clean install done so this should not really apply to you but over time lots of small add-ons and utilities tend to find their way onto computers. These can cause significant slowdowns so it is always advisable to remove anything that you do not need and not to install new things unnecessarily. Quite often an uninstall is not able to successfully remove everything that it added.

Have you checked your registry? This is one to try only if you feel comfortable with it. Do not change anything in the registry unless you know what you are doing and ideally with a back-up available. There are certain places to look for malware which are good to be aware of. The first is Microsoft-Windows-CurrentVersion-Run (sorry not to give a full path here but I am at work and do not have access). This is the section where things are selected for running at boot-up (such as utilities for your graphics card and always-on software). You should know EVERYTHING that is referenced in this section. Anything you are unsure of, type the filename into Google and check that the results match the file location. This is the most common location for viruses to install themselves into. The second place is under BrowserHelperObjects. Again I cannot give you a proper path but there is only one location that matches if you run a search. A few more advanced malware programs hide themselves here. This section is not always easy to interpret so you should probably not bother unless you are very PC-literate other than to note what is already installed.

Finally, to remove temporary files you can just open internet options, either through Control Panel or from Internet Explorer itself. This is the third common place where malware hides itself. There is also a windows temporary folder in, I think, the top level windows directory. You can clear some old relics out of here too but it is only rarely a haven for malware or other problems.

Good luck with it - I doubt very much you need a new computer only for browsing-style activities. More likely there is a problem with your connection, either directly, on your network, or within your computer. You may be able to find something yourself, you might need professional help. But unless you have another reason for needing a new computer then I would tend to agree with the poster that suggested having someone look before buying would be a good idea. Do check yourself first though and make notes of everything you did - if nothing else this might save the professional some time in tracking down something.

Hmm I have been trying to figure out how to cut this into bits to answer each bit and I can't seem to do it so sorry if this is a bit disorderly.

1)I have AVG and Spybot Search & Destroy on both of them. The desktop became unable to access windows updates some time back (something I had asked the tech guys to look at but I dont think they did. I'm not very sure they did anything at all, really. But at least they didn't charge me much:). I occassionally buy stuff through the internet so although AVG is getting to be pretty pushy and annoying I'm afraid to go without something.

2) I have no idea how to check on the speed of the connection. It's the only game in town anyway unless I want to go to satellite.

3)I have no idea how to check this.

4)I didnt make a note of what was in it when I got it so now I haven't a clue what's supposed to be there and what isn't. That's what I took it to the techs for. As far as using wireless, not really reliably available in this area..like a cell phone you have to be in a special spot and not move or it wont work at all. So both are used wired up.

5) Registry is something I'm not comfortable messing with. About 8 months ago I tried doing a "return to earlier configuration" on the desktop and almost everything disappeared..I had asked it to go back a couple of months and it apparently went back to about 2004. I never did get back some programs such as Word. So now I don't touch anything if I don't know what it is and since I don't know what much of anything is.....

6) I do do the temporary file removal thing on a regular(ish) basis.

Thanks for your suggestions. If I do get a new desktop at least, then I'll get the seller to identify what's in there. Someone said that Linux was a lot easier to use now than it used to be, that they actually even have two versions now one for the "casual"user and one for the real computer people so I was thinking of having someone install it for me. I actually like Windows, Hotmail and Explorer format better than the others I've tried (so out of step with most people it seems) but they are so extremely unhelpful to deal with if there is a problem, frustration is driving me to look for an alternative. Every time I have tried Firefox it kept crashing and Google thinks it's God. So now I am using Opera on the desktop and struggling along with Windows on the laptop. Of course, perhaps I will find an Apple calling my name..in which case it won't be an issue, right?

I really appreciate all the great help here ! You guys are terrific!