[mikeh]

 aguahombre, on 2011-November-10, 10:56, said:

Even though I brought up that this treatment (nebulous 3D) is played, I don't use it (yet); hence I didn't answer. We will both have to try aspirin for sleep.

Actually, we are considering reverting to non-puppet because of uneven major issues, and re-adopting Smolen/delay Texas follow-ups after 3C plus extended Walsh Relays after a 3D xfer. We will lose an occasional 5-3 fit where opener has five, but gain in other cases.

How about this scheme:

3♣ stayman, responses as follows:

3♦: no 4 card major, no 5 card ♥ suit, may have 5♠
3♥: 4 hearts, may have 4♠
3♠: 4♠, denies 4♥
3N: 5♥

Over 3♦, responder bids 3♥ with all non-smolen hands, and bids 3♠ with 4♠ and longer hearts, 3N with 4♥s and longer spades, non-forcing, and 4♥ with 4♥ and longer spades, unwilling to play 3N (too strong or too shapely).

Over 3♥, which may have spades as well as hearts, responder bids 3♠ to puppet to 3N, denying spades, and either 3N or 4N or 5N with 4 spades...3N to pass or correct, 4N as invitational, p/c and 5n as forcing with 4♠.

Over the 3N response to 3♣, 4♦ by responder transfers to hearts.

This seems to cover all of the relevant bases and allows one to use puppet as well as smolen while (usually) getting the strong hand as declarer.

[aguahombre]

Tks, Mike. That would make my concerns go away about puppet, and still keep Walsh 3D.

[TWO4BRIDGE]

Mikeh.....

I: still see the same problem about not being able to stop in 3NT ( when you want to ) after the 3D reply by Opener :
[ EDIT: I think I see the answer ...that I show below ]

2NT - 3C
3D - ??

3D = no 4M, no 5h, but may have 5s

?? Responder, say, has 4h and only 2s and wants to play in 3NT; but your 3NT now is 4h and longer Sp.

EDIT: I think I see your answer: Responder bids 3H with all non-Smolen hands.... then Opener bids 3NT to play or 3S with 5s and Responder can then sign-off in 3NT.

This post has been edited by TWO4BRIDGE: 2011-November-10, 14:42

[mikeh]

 TWO4BRIDGE, on 2011-November-10, 14:35, said:

Mikeh.....

I: still see the same problem about not being able to stop in 3NT ( when you want to ) after the 3D reply by Opener :

2NT - 3C
3D - ??

3D = no 4M, no 5h, but may have 5s

?? Responder, say, has 4h and only 2s and wants to play in 3NT; but your 3NT now is 4h and longer Sp.

That is why responder's default bid....made 100% of the time absent a smolen hand, is to bid an artificial 3♥ over 3♦. Opener bids 3♠ with 5 spades and 3N otherwise.

This sequence is counter-intuitive and I screwed it up, with spectacular results, when I learned it and my current partner did likewise when he learned it. The good news is that the screw-ups tend to have significant impact and that's the way I learn best

[TWO4BRIDGE]

Thx, Mike...
.... I saw the answer ( my EDIT ] as you were typing your reply.

[olien]

I just like a relatively simple structure over 2NT:

3♣ = stayman or natural slam try
3♦/♥ = transfers
3♠ = both minors
3NT = to play
4♣ = ♦ slam interest
4♦/♥ = transfers


After 2NT-3♣:
3♦ = no 4M
3M = 4/5 M but not 4oM
3NT = 4/4 Majors, poor hand for slam
4♣ = 4/4 Majors, good hand for slam

This structure is possible as 3♣ either promises 4M or is slam going single-suiter with ♣.

After 2NT-3♣// 3♦:
3M = smolen
3NT = to play
4♣ = quantitative minorwood (4♦=bad hand, 4♥+=good hand, responding keycard)
4♦ = natural with 4M


After 2NT-3♣// 3♥:
3♠ = slam going ♥ raise
3NT = to play
4♣ = quantitative minorwood (as above)
4♦ = natural with 4♠ (but now 4♠ = cue since opener has denied having 4♠)


After 2NT-3♣// 3♠:
3NT = to play
4♣ = quantitative minorwood
4♦ = natural with 4♥
4♥ = slam going ♠ raise


After 2NT-3♣// 3NT:
4♣ = quantitative minorwood
4♦/♥ = transfers

After 2NT-3♣// 4♣:
4♦/♥ = transfers
4♠ = RKC for ♣


2NT-3♦// 3♥-3♠ = 5/5 majors mild+ slam interest (now 4m=major suit flag, 4M=neg)

2NT-4♣:
Respond as though quantitative minorwood.

I like this structure for its simplicity and its ability to cover hands. My experience has rarely been that missing the 5-3M fit and playing 3NT evens out over time. Maybe this structure can be improved, but its not mine. It was suggested to me by JDonn and he said he got it from a very good player, so I'll take his word for it.