[runewell]

From a team game:

http://online.bridgebase.com/myhands/fetch...ayed=1276825689

♠ A
♥ AKQJT862
♦ A
♣ AK2

If I told you partner had only one face card, what would you bid?
Click on the link to find out what happened.

[OleBerg]

runewell, on Jun 18 2010, 05:03 AM, said:

From a team game:

http://online.bridgebase.com/myhands/fetch...ayed=1276825689

♠ A
♥ AKQJT862
♦ A
♣ AK2

If I told you partner had only one face card, what would you bid?
Click on the link to find out what happened.

How did the play go? Was the claim contested?

[Free]

Can't read the lin file here.

I'd start with 2♣, now depending on what he responds (2♦ positive):
- 2♥ => I'll set ♥, RKC, and bid 6♣ to ask for a 2nd round control
- 2♦ => I'll show ♥, and now it depends if partner raised:
...-> partner raised: then I'll just bid grand (partner has a King or 2 Queens)
...-> partner didn't raise: then I'll ask for a 3rd round control ♣.

[kgr]

You want to set ♥ as trump and ask 3rd round control in ♣.
Opening 7♥ is an anti-percentage gamble.
In my system:
3♣-3♦ (3♣ is trnasfer preempt or something strong)
3♥-4♥ (3♥ is GF with ♥, 4♥ is no controls)
6♣... (6♣ asks 3rd round control. This cannot be a 2nd suit in our system because with a GF ♥/♣ we open 3♦...)

[whereagles]

Unless you have a system that can accurately pin-point the club queen, I think the best way to avoid a headache is to open 6♥. I guess

2♣ 3♣ (nat, decent 5 card suit)
7♥

would be just about the only sensible way to get there on standard methods.

[dicklont]

whereagles, on Jun 18 2010, 11:47 AM, said:

[..]
2♣ 3♣ (nat, decent 5 card suit)
[..]

I would be greedy and bid 7NT.

[Fluffy]

yeah it is hrd to imagine how can playing in hearts be worth anything at all

[gwnn]

6NT opener asking for third round control of clubs anyone? do you play it as something now?

in fact how about

5H 3rd round control of hearts
5S 3rd round control of spades
5N 3rd round control of diamonds
6N 3rd round control of clubs

those 5M preempts never come up anyway

[pooltuna]

runewell, on Jun 17 2010, 10:03 PM, said:

From a team game:

http://online.bridgebase.com/myhands/fetch...ayed=1276825689

♠ A
♥ AKQJT862
♦ A
♣ AK2

If I told you partner had only one face card, what would you bid?
Click on the link to find out what happened.

6NT. Yeah you are at 55%+ to make 7 but still not quite high enough IMO

[matmat]

pooltuna, on Jun 18 2010, 08:40 AM, said:

6NT. Yeah you are at 55%+  to make 7 but still not quite high enough IMO

hmmm? 55 seems somewhat arbitrary

[pooltuna]

matmat, on Jun 18 2010, 08:48 AM, said:

pooltuna, on Jun 18 2010, 08:40 AM, said:

6NT. Yeah you are at 55%+  to make 7 but still not quite high enough IMO

hmmm? 55 seems somewhat arbitrary

well you need either the ♣Q or ♥9. Obviously ♥9 only works if dummy has ♠K, ♦K, or ♣JT with finesse working. The possibility of dummy having 6♣ is a positive. I just rounded to the probability of holding either or both of the first 2, i.e 1-(.66)*(.66)= 5/9

[matmat]

pooltuna, on Jun 18 2010, 08:56 AM, said:

matmat, on Jun 18 2010, 08:48 AM, said:

pooltuna, on Jun 18 2010, 08:40 AM, said:

6NT. Yeah you are at 55%+  to make 7 but still not quite high enough IMO

hmmm? 55 seems somewhat arbitrary

well you need either the ♣Q or ♥9. Obviously ♥9 only works if dummy has ♠K, ♦K, or ♣JT with finesse working. The possibility of dummy having 6♣ is a positive. I just rounded to the probability of holding either or both of the first 2, i.e 1-(.66)*(.66)= 5/9

also a chace of the H7 being promoted to an entry.

[Fluffy]

playing natural methods open 2♣, rebid 3♣ ad notice if partner raises, if he does not we can settle for 7♥, if he does raise we can gladly ask keycards and trump queen. But if he decides to show ♣Q because he's got 4 or 5 small I'll hate him .

[aguahombre]

There is just barely room to do it with:

2C-2D (waiting)
3H*4H* --3h set trumps, 4H denied any ace or king.
5C*5D* --5c asking, 5D denies singleton or void (already denied ace or king)
6C*6NT* --again asking, 6NT shows queen.
7N

The advantage of setting hearts as trump (instead of clubs) temporarily would come when responder has club shortness and 7H works.

[Bbradley62]

pooltuna, on Jun 18 2010, 09:56 AM, said:

matmat, on Jun 18 2010, 08:48 AM, said:

pooltuna, on Jun 18 2010, 08:40 AM, said:

6NT. Yeah you are at 55%+  to make 7 but still not quite high enough IMO

hmmm? 55 seems somewhat arbitrary

well you need either the ♣Q or ♥9. Obviously ♥9 only works if dummy has ♠K, ♦K, or ♣JT with finesse working. The possibility of dummy having 6♣ is a positive. I just rounded to the probability of holding either or both of the first 2, i.e 1-(.66)*(.66)= 5/9

No. This is ignoring the major piece of information that partner has exactly one face card. You can start by recognizing that if partner's one face card is Q/J of ♠/♦, which is 4 out of 8, we're screwed. The questions are (a) which is partner's face card, and (b) can we get to it? So...

There's a 1/8 chance that partner has the Q♣.
There's a 1/4 chance that partner has K of ♠ or ♦.
There's a 1/8 chance that partner has J♣, and therefore a 1/40 chance that partner has JT♣ with Q onside. (Partner holds 12/31 of outstanding non-face cards, not 1/3.)
There's about 51.5% chance that partner has a ♥ entry. (I'll provide this if asked, but again the key is that partner has 12/31 of outstanding non-face cards.)

Chance of 7NT = 1/8 + (11/40)(.515) = 26.66%, plus the chance of running 12 tricks and having neither opponent keep a club (or Q♣ dropping doubleton, etc)

If we can open 2♣ then bid 3♣ and hope to get suit agreement before RKC in clubs, that would be great. Otherwise, signing off in 6NT is probably wise.

This post has been edited by Bbradley62: 2010-June-18, 15:31

[ONEferBRID]

aguahombre, on Jun 18 2010, 01:10 PM, said:

There is just barely room to do it with:

2C-2D (waiting)
3H*4H* --3h set trumps, 4H denied any ace or king.
5C*5D* --5c asking, 5D denies singleton or void (already denied ace or king)
6C*6NT* --again asking, 6NT shows queen.
7N

The advantage of setting hearts as trump (instead of clubs) temporarily would come when responder has club shortness and 7H works.

Mine would be similar to Aquaman's ... starting with 2C!.
1) If partner gves a positive suit response ( 2♠ or 3♦ ) I'll go 4NT ( meaning partner's suit is ostensibly "agreed trumps" ).
If partner has a Ht void, I'm screwed as far as a ♣Q-ask is concerned and I'll just have to setlle in 6NT; but if not, then
after any reply, I'll bid 6C! which is 3rd-Rnd-Ctrl-ask in Cl... since the 5NT ( K-ask was by-passed ).
If partner shows the ♣Q, 7NT is a lock.
If not, then sign-off in 6NT.

2C - 2S
4NT - 5C ( 0 or 3 )
6C! - 6NT = ♣Q ( bidding NT shows asked for feature; 6S = no ♣Q)
7NT
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
2) If 2D! ( waiting, but positive ), then 3H-jump = setting trumps.
Over any reply, go RKC ( for Hts ) and then the 6C! = 3rd Rnd Ctrl Ask as before.

3) If 2H! = bust... If 2C = a GF no matter what, then bid 3H ... and RKC-ask, and ♣Q-ask as before.

[runewell]

Plus you have a 1/3 chance that the opponents aren't going to have a clue what to keep, they can only have two cards at the end.