[dcohio]

There is a pair at my club that plays weak openings:

1♣ = strong 15+ artificial F1
1[x] = 8-10/12 5+ [x]
1NT = 10-12 seat 1/2 12-14 seat 3/4 semi balanced
2[x] = 12-15 6+ [x]

Any good defenses vs these openings?

[TimG]

I'm curious, what do they open with 13-14 and a five-card suit (unbalanced)? Or, 13-14 balanced in 1st and 2nd?

[peachy]

TimG, on Dec 18 2009, 10:27 AM, said:

I'm curious, what do they open with 13-14 and a five-card suit (unbalanced)? Or, 13-14 balanced in 1st and 2nd?

Perhaps they Pass, as some species of Forcing Pass? Just guessing...also curious.

[dcohio]

I'm not 100% sure, these were the alerts we got, and I didn't get a chance to study their conv. card.

[TimG]

I wonder how strong a 1st or 2nd seat pass can be before it requires an alert (ACBL) and/or become GCC illegal.

[PrecisionL]

Yes, play Meyer's Doubles (The Meyer System, by Harlan Meyer, Nashville, TN, 1963).

X for Penalty with:

a) 12+ hcp not including Js with QTxx or better, or

b) 16+ hcp and Kxx or better in opener's suit. Double only when the hand is unsuitable for takeout.

Partner of the doubler:

Pass with 0-8,9 hcp for penalty or the least of evils.

Pass with 7-12 hcp and xx or better in trumps: However, sometimes 1NT is better if they are nV.

13-14 hcp bid 2NT and no 5-cd suit (depending on vulnerability)
15-16 hcp bid 3NT and no 5-cd suit (depending on vulnerability)

13+ and 5-cd suit: Single jump in suit
13+ and 6-cd suit: Double jump in suit

Larry

[TimG]

PrecisionL, on Dec 18 2009, 04:30 PM, said:

Yes, play Meyer's Doubles (The Meyer System, by Harlan Meyer, Nashville, TN, 1963).

X for Penalty with:

a) 12+ hcp not including Js with QTxx or better, or

16+ hcp and Kxx or better in opener's suit. Double only when the hand is unsuitable for takeout.

What do you do when you have a takeout hand? Trap pass?

[blackshoe]

TimG, on Dec 18 2009, 03:13 PM, said:

I wonder how strong a 1st or 2nd seat pass can be before it requires an alert (ACBL) and/or become GCC illegal.

Forcing Pass systems are illegal at all levels in the ACBL. Of course, they neglected to define "Forcing Pass system" so....

OTOH, methods not explicitly allowed on the charts are disallowed, and no value-showing pass is allowed, so if pass shows values, it's not allowed. Again, at all levels.
OTGH, it is unclear what the situation is wrt passes which may have values, but also may not. If ACBL tournament directors (who are ACBL employees) have received guidance on this point, I'm not aware of it. Club TDs certainly have not, at least not from Memphis.

[PrecisionL]

TimG, on Dec 18 2009, 06:06 PM, said:

PrecisionL, on Dec 18 2009, 04:30 PM, said:

Yes, play Meyer's Doubles (The Meyer System, by Harlan Meyer, Nashville, TN, 1963).

X for Penalty with:

a) 12+ hcp not including Js with QTxx or better, or

b) 16+ hcp and Kxx or better in opener's suit.  Double only when the hand is unsuitable for takeout.

What do you do when you have a takeout hand? Trap pass?

I thought this was obvious, sorry. There is NO trap pass, you double with that type of hand.

Pass with minimum hands and overcall 1NT for takeout with 15 or more pts. including distribution.

Larry

[TimG]

PrecisionL, on Dec 18 2009, 10:17 PM, said:

TimG, on Dec 18 2009, 06:06 PM, said:

PrecisionL, on Dec 18 2009, 04:30 PM, said:

Yes, play Meyer's Doubles (The Meyer System, by Harlan Meyer, Nashville, TN, 1963).

X for Penalty with:

a) 12+ hcp not including Js with QTxx or better, or

16+ hcp and Kxx or better in opener's suit.  Double only when the hand is unsuitable for takeout.

What do you do when you have a takeout hand? Trap pass?

I thought this was obvious, sorry. There is NO trap pass, you double with that type of hand.

It was a possible answer to the question I asked -- you had not defined a 1NT overcall.

I strikes me as a bad idea to use a direct double to, in effect, warn the opponents. They can probably slow down more easily after your double. Just because you have QTxx or better in the suit they open does not mean that responder would not raise, maybe even jump raise. I think you should prefer to give them some room to really hang themselves.

But, maybe I misunderstand and the objective really isn't to make them pay.

[TimG]

blackshoe, on Dec 18 2009, 09:20 PM, said:

TimG, on Dec 18 2009, 03:13 PM, said:

I wonder how strong a 1st or 2nd seat pass can be before it requires an alert (ACBL) and/or become GCC illegal.

Forcing Pass systems are illegal at all levels in the ACBL. Of course, they neglected to define "Forcing Pass system" so....

OTOH, methods not explicitly allowed on the charts are disallowed, and no value-showing pass is allowed, so if pass shows values, it's not allowed.

I was careful not to call it a forcing pass because it wouldn't be forcing.

Pass would not be value showing, it would have a split range of something like 0-7 or 13-14 in this case, so it would not promise values.

No pass is explicitly allowed on the charts, is it?