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Why is life worth living?

#21 User is offline   mikeh 

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Posted 2008-June-23, 12:20

1. Humans are not rational animals. We've had enough discussion in the watercooler to afford some proof of that :lol:

2. We represent one of the current twigs on the bush of evolutionary development: our minds have evolved as much as the rest of our bodies, and we have inherited our ways of thinking/feeling/reacting from ancestral species, modified over time.

3. It seems reasonable to argue that a relative willingness to suicide, whether by actively and fatally injuring oneself or by refusing to eat or drink, would be a competitive disadvantage in an ancestral species. Not matter how bleak the outlook might be, in the life of an animal still capable of reproduction, some part of the time, that animal will survive and reproduce... unless it suicided. So the animals that tend to suicide will reproduce less frequently than those that don't.. all else being equal. Thus natural selection will tend to produce animals that cling to life rather than animals that give up easily.

4. Fear of death is a reasonable corollary of the will to live... and fear of death will be a competitive advantage. Any animal that is indifferent to risk of death or serious injury (serious injury usually means death to most animals and humans before modern medicine) will expose itself to more risk of death than would the one afraid of the risk.. and therefore will die younger, and leave fewer descendants.

5. Fear of death may also have played a role in the development of religion, altho Diamond in Guns, Germs and Steel (and others) have attributed much of the success of organized religion to efforts by early leaders of human societies to maximize their power over their subjects.

So I take issue with the introductory assumption, in the OP, that living or dying is a matter of choice. It is, in the sense that we all have the ability to kill ourselves, but it isn't, in the sense that our minds allow us to select either 'choice' with no preset (and extremely powerful) bias against the death option.
'one of the great markers of the advance of human kindness is the howls you will hear from the Men of God' Johann Hari
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#22 User is offline   jtfanclub 

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Posted 2008-June-23, 12:35

I know what life is.

When somebody dies and tells me about it, then I might choose death.

But, ya know, I don't like doing something if nobody can tell me what it's like from personal experience. :lol:
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#23 User is offline   Al_U_Card 

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Posted 2008-June-23, 14:32

Life is opportunity. Death is definition.

Life is struggle. Death is transition.

Life is commitment. Death is release.

Life is discovery. Death is exploitation.

Life is realization. Death is integration.

The pie-man says:

I feel that we as humans, do not handle death well because it is the point of no return. That finality, goes against the continued nature that we are used to in our life. We as humans are used to a flow, a process, and it's forward going. Now, all of the sudden, it stops.

What a strange idea. Unlike everything else in the universe....how unique.
The Grand Design, reflected in the face of Chaos...it's a fluke!
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#24 User is offline   kenberg 

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Posted 2008-June-23, 14:59

Jlall, on Jun 22 2008, 03:41 AM, said:

Assuming living is a choice, why do people choose to live? Isn't it rational for a lot of people to choose not to live?

Such a question gives me the jitters. We are just gabbing, right? If not, find someone you trust pronto.

As for me, there are people who are important to me and, I think, to whom I am important. Guess I'll stick around.
Ken
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#25 User is offline   rogerclee 

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Posted 2008-June-23, 17:52

pclayton, on Jun 22 2008, 09:15 AM, said:

By the way, if you need a lift, I would recommend Guitar Hero 3.

Agree with Phil.
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#26 Guest_Jlall_*

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Posted 2008-June-23, 18:06

rogerclee, on Jun 23 2008, 06:52 PM, said:

pclayton, on Jun 22 2008, 09:15 AM, said:

By the way, if you need a lift, I would recommend Guitar Hero 3.

Agree with Phil.

Will take any of you on in xbox live pro face offs.
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#27 User is offline   pclayton 

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Posted 2008-June-23, 18:08

Jlall, on Jun 23 2008, 04:06 PM, said:

rogerclee, on Jun 23 2008, 06:52 PM, said:

pclayton, on Jun 22 2008, 09:15 AM, said:

By the way, if you need a lift, I would recommend Guitar Hero 3.

Agree with Phil.

Will take any of you on in xbox live pro face offs.

Maybe if you tape two of your fingers together.
"Phil" on BBO
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#28 Guest_Jlall_*

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Posted 2008-June-23, 18:08

kenberg, on Jun 23 2008, 03:59 PM, said:

Jlall, on Jun 22 2008, 03:41 AM, said:

Assuming living is a choice, why do people choose to live? Isn't it rational for a lot of people to choose not to live?

Such a question gives me the jitters. We are just gabbing, right? If not, find someone you trust pronto.

As for me, there are people who are important to me and, I think, to whom I am important. Guess I'll stick around.

Personally my life quality is quite high, and I did well in the genetic lottery. However I definitely think if I was some other people I would kill myself, and would consider it a rational choice. I'm sure not many other people feel this way though, so just curious. I am not sure why asking this question should give one jitters, I think that also is irrational.
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#29 User is offline   zasanya 

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Posted 2008-June-23, 20:39

Jlall, on Jun 23 2008, 07:08 PM, said:

kenberg, on Jun 23 2008, 03:59 PM, said:

Jlall, on Jun 22 2008, 03:41 AM, said:

Assuming living is a choice, why do people choose to live? Isn't it rational for a lot of people to choose not to live?

Such a question gives me the jitters. We are just gabbing, right? If not, find someone you trust pronto.

As for me, there are people who are important to me and, I think, to whom I am important. Guess I'll stick around.

Personally my life quality is quite high, and I did well in the genetic lottery. However I definitely think if I was some other people I would kill myself, and would consider it a rational choice. I'm sure not many other people feel this way though, so just curious. I am not sure why asking this question should give one jitters, I think that also is irrational.

1)Sometime back there was a thread in which a question was asked.What do you hate most in life?(or something to this effect;Dont remmber the exact words) One of the answer was "My birth".
2) Sometime back there was a thread "Why do we SUCK(emphasis mine) at bridge?
3)Now this thread.
When a talented young man makes these posts the father and counsellor in me gets jittery.
Kenberg perhaps has the same reasons.
Aniruddha
Do unto others as you would have others do unto you.
"Mediocrity knows nothing higher than itself, but talent instantly recognizes genius".
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#30 User is offline   rogerclee 

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Posted 2008-June-23, 23:19

Jlall, on Jun 23 2008, 05:06 PM, said:

rogerclee, on Jun 23 2008, 06:52 PM, said:

pclayton, on Jun 22 2008, 09:15 AM, said:

By the way, if you need a lift, I would recommend Guitar Hero 3.

Agree with Phil.

Will take any of you on in xbox live pro face offs.

I use the Wii :).
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#31 User is offline   Al_U_Card 

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Posted 2008-June-24, 02:01

zasanya, on Jun 23 2008, 09:39 PM, said:

Jlall, on Jun 23 2008, 07:08 PM, said:

kenberg, on Jun 23 2008, 03:59 PM, said:

Jlall, on Jun 22 2008, 03:41 AM, said:

Assuming living is a choice, why do people choose to live? Isn't it rational for a lot of people to choose not to live?

Such a question gives me the jitters. We are just gabbing, right? If not, find someone you trust pronto.

As for me, there are people who are important to me and, I think, to whom I am important. Guess I'll stick around.

Personally my life quality is quite high, and I did well in the genetic lottery. However I definitely think if I was some other people I would kill myself, and would consider it a rational choice. I'm sure not many other people feel this way though, so just curious. I am not sure why asking this question should give one jitters, I think that also is irrational.

1)Sometime back there was a thread in which a question was asked.What do you hate most in life?(or something to this effect;Dont remmber the exact words) One of the answer was "My birth".
2) Sometime back there was a thread "Why do we SUCK(emphasis mine) at bridge?
3)Now this thread.
When a talented young man makes these posts the father and counsellor in me gets jittery.
Kenberg perhaps has the same reasons.

The tendency of youth to challenge and repudiate the tenets of the aged is typical, healthy and understandable. That it make you jittery just shows the level of your investment in your own world-view. Nothing unusual about that either.

Justin, continue to question and to investigate. Youth will be served.
The Grand Design, reflected in the face of Chaos...it's a fluke!
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#32 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2008-June-24, 04:04

Life is my friend
Rake it up to take it in.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#33 User is offline   kfay 

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Posted 2008-June-24, 08:41

I saw the title to this thread and I thought it must have been in reference to the Turkey-Netherlands match.
Kevin Fay
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