Help
you have
A109863
Q72
play for 5 tricks
Page 1 of 1
Suit combo Probably it was talked about before
#1
- World International Master without a clue
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 17,404
- Joined: 2003-November-13
- Gender:Male
- Location:madrid
Posted 2008-February-24, 19:53
#2
- Under bidder
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 11,797
- Joined: 2004-July-25
- Gender:Male
- Location:Amsterdam, the Netherlands
Posted 2008-February-24, 20:34
Wrong forum.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.
- hrothgar
- hrothgar
#3 Guest_Jlall_*
Posted 2008-February-24, 20:35
Heh, this one is my favorite, small to the 7 is correct. Han why is this wrong forum?
#4
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 2,211
- Joined: 2006-April-22
Posted 2008-February-25, 00:18
Is this past beginner combos? So advanced or expert?
#5
- Group: Full Members
- Posts: 925
- Joined: 2004-September-13
- Gender:Male
- Location:England
- Interests:I have discovered that the water cooler is a chrono-synclastic infundibulum
Posted 2008-February-25, 04:24
This looks like a sister problem to the one I posted in "Interesting bridge hands", where I went wrong at the table. I have learned from this so would do as Justin says.
May 2003: Mission accomplished
Oct 2006: Mission impossible
Soon: Mission illegal
Oct 2006: Mission impossible
Soon: Mission illegal
#6
- Andy Bowles
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 11,993
- Joined: 2007-May-03
- Gender:Male
- Location:London, UK
Posted 2008-February-25, 04:35
I was sufficiently surprised by Justin's answer that I had to stop and think about it. but he is, of course, right.
Small to the seven loses to East's K54, K5 and K4. That's roughly:
1/8 x 50 + 2/6 x 41 = 20
Running the queen loses to East's KJ4, KJ5, KJ and KJ54, which is:
2/8 x 50 + 1/6 x 41 + 1/2 x 10 = 24
Ace and another loses to East's 5, 4, KJ54 and void, which is:
2/8 x 50 + 2/2 x 10 = 22.5
So, it wouldn't take much to make me play one of the other lines.
Small to the seven loses to East's K54, K5 and K4. That's roughly:
1/8 x 50 + 2/6 x 41 = 20
Running the queen loses to East's KJ4, KJ5, KJ and KJ54, which is:
2/8 x 50 + 1/6 x 41 + 1/2 x 10 = 24
Ace and another loses to East's 5, 4, KJ54 and void, which is:
2/8 x 50 + 2/2 x 10 = 22.5
So, it wouldn't take much to make me play one of the other lines.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
#7
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 1,625
- Joined: 2006-October-04
- Location:Denmark
Posted 2008-February-25, 06:36
The big upside is that righty might rise with the K from Kx.
Michael Askgaard
#8 Guest_Jlall_*
Posted 2008-February-25, 06:57
gnasher, on Feb 25 2008, 05:35 AM, said:
I was sufficiently surprised by Justin's answer that I had to stop and think about it. but he is, of course, right.
Small to the seven loses to East's K54, K5 and K4. That's roughly:
1/8 x 50 + 2/6 x 41 = 20
Running the queen loses to East's KJ4, KJ5, KJ and KJ54, which is:
2/8 x 50 + 1/6 x 41 + 1/2 x 10 = 24
Ace and another loses to East's 5, 4, KJ54 and void, which is:
2/8 x 50 + 2/2 x 10 = 22.5
So, it wouldn't take much to make me play one of the other lines.
Small to the seven loses to East's K54, K5 and K4. That's roughly:
1/8 x 50 + 2/6 x 41 = 20
Running the queen loses to East's KJ4, KJ5, KJ and KJ54, which is:
2/8 x 50 + 1/6 x 41 + 1/2 x 10 = 24
Ace and another loses to East's 5, 4, KJ54 and void, which is:
2/8 x 50 + 2/2 x 10 = 22.5
So, it wouldn't take much to make me play one of the other lines.
Hehe right everyone thinks ace and another is right, even among the very top players few people know this one.
It applies only with a 6-3 fit and the queen being third otherwise ace and another can pick up one 4-0 split and becomes the favorite.
Of course as others have mentioned from a non-technical point of view since people pop from Kx at least some percentage of the time leading small rather than the ace is often right, even with a 5-4 fit (when it is the wrong play against perfect defense).
#9
- Andy Bowles
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 11,993
- Joined: 2007-May-03
- Gender:Male
- Location:London, UK
Posted 2008-February-25, 07:55
Jlall, on Feb 25 2008, 01:57 PM, said:
It applies only with a 6-3 fit and the queen being third otherwise ace and another can pick up one 4-0 split and becomes the favorite.
And only when you have good enough spots. You need at least A109732 opposite Q54 or A105432 opposite Q96.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
#10
- 5555
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 9,520
- Joined: 2003-September-04
- Gender:Male
Posted 2008-February-25, 08:10
gnasher, on Feb 25 2008, 04:35 AM, said:
I was sufficiently surprised by Justin's answer that I had to stop and think about it. but he is, of course, right.
Small to the seven loses to East's K54, K5 and K4. That's roughly:
1/8 x 50 + 2/6 x 41 = 20
Small to the seven loses to East's K54, K5 and K4. That's roughly:
1/8 x 50 + 2/6 x 41 = 20
Not quite I think - after the 7 loses to the Jack, you should cash the ace. So it only loses to K54, 5 and 4.
The easiest way to count losers is to line up the people who talk about loser count, and count them. -Kieran Dyke
#11
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 3,972
- Joined: 2004-July-25
- Gender:Male
- Location:Maine, USA
Posted 2008-February-25, 08:45
cherdano, on Feb 25 2008, 09:10 AM, said:
gnasher, on Feb 25 2008, 04:35 AM, said:
I was sufficiently surprised by Justin's answer that I had to stop and think about it. but he is, of course, right.
Small to the seven loses to East's K54, K5 and K4. That's roughly:
1/8 x 50 + 2/6 x 41 = 20
Small to the seven loses to East's K54, K5 and K4. That's roughly:
1/8 x 50 + 2/6 x 41 = 20
Not quite I think - after the 7 loses to the Jack, you should cash the ace. So it only loses to K54, 5 and 4.
You are right.
But, in practice, RHO will pop King some of the time when he holds Kx. He doesn't have to do this often to make the second round finesse the better line.
Right?
#12
- Andy Bowles
-
- Group: Advanced Members
- Posts: 11,993
- Joined: 2007-May-03
- Gender:Male
- Location:London, UK
Posted 2008-February-25, 08:45
cherdano, on Feb 25 2008, 03:10 PM, said:
gnasher, on Feb 25 2008, 04:35 AM, said:
Small to the seven loses to East's K54, K5 and K4. That's roughly:
1/8 x 50 + 2/6 x 41 = 20
1/8 x 50 + 2/6 x 41 = 20
Not quite I think - after the 7 loses to the Jack, you should cash the ace. So it only loses to K54, 5 and 4.
That's true. I made the same mistake when considering running the queen. After it loses, you should play for the drop, losing to K but gaining against KJ.
Most of this seems quite counterintuitive to me. Just goes to show that, in my case at least, intuition is no substitute for analysis.
... that would still not be conclusive proof, before someone wants to explain that to me as well as if I was a 5 year-old. - gwnn
Page 1 of 1