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Everyone Likes Their Hand

#1 User is offline   Apollo81 

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Posted 2008-January-31, 10:36

♠Axxx
♥AKxx
♦QJxx
♣x

favorable, MPs

1♦-(2♣)-X-(2NT)
??
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#2 User is offline   ArtK78 

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Posted 2008-January-31, 10:37

3♣. What else?
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#3 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2008-January-31, 10:38

Heh, funny auction. I'd X, going for the magic 200 but maybe I lead the wrong major and they cash 8 minor tricks.

Let's just bid 3♣ (good hand with both majors?).
... and I can prove it with my usual, flawless logic.
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#4 User is offline   helene_t 

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Posted 2008-January-31, 10:59

3♣, better show my majors before they bid 3♣ or even 4♣.
The world would be such a happy place, if only everyone played Acol :) --- TramTicket
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#5 User is offline   jtfanclub 

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Posted 2008-January-31, 11:11

I suspect the 2NT bid is a joke, and they plan to pull to 3♣ if X'd.
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#6 User is offline   P_Marlowe 

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Posted 2008-January-31, 11:15

X.

With kind regards
Marlowe
With kind regards
Uwe Gebhardt (P_Marlowe)
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#7 User is offline   pclayton 

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Posted 2008-January-31, 21:51

4♣ probably.
"Phil" on BBO
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#8 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2008-January-31, 21:57

I was also thinking 4C, does this show club shortness and both majors?
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#9 User is offline   the hog 

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Posted 2008-January-31, 23:08

3C, ignore the joker.
"The King of Hearts a broadsword bears, the Queen of Hearts a rose." W. H. Auden.
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#10 User is offline   gwnn 

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Posted 2008-February-01, 00:16

Hannie, on Feb 1 2008, 05:57 AM, said:

I was also thinking 4C, does this show club shortness and both majors?

I'd think it shows both majors and a vgood hand.
... and I can prove it with my usual, flawless logic.
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#11 User is offline   skjaeran 

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Posted 2008-February-01, 00:23

3♣ for me. 4♣ slightly overstates our values IMO.
Kind regards,
Harald
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#12 User is offline   jtfanclub 

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Posted 2008-February-01, 10:09

P_Marlowe, on Jan 31 2008, 12:15 PM, said:

X.

With kind regards
Marlowe

OK...suppose the 2NT is a joke, or at least over-exuberant.

1♦ (2♣) -X- (2NT)
-X- (-P-) -P- (3♣)

Now what? I play an X here as penalty, which I think is pretty common.
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#13 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2008-February-01, 10:41

Must admit I have never discussed this auction so I have some questions.

Does 4C really show a better hand than 3C?

If it next goes 3C - p - 3M, can you pass that?

Does 3C guarantee both majors or could you also have some solid diamond hand?

Would the answers to these questions be different if there wasn't a 2NT call?
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#14 User is offline   Apollo81 

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Posted 2008-February-01, 10:45

Hannie, on Feb 1 2008, 11:41 AM, said:

If it next goes 3C - p - 3M, can you pass that?

This is one of the things that motivated the post, I'm interested in what people think about this since I wouldn't feel sure.
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#15 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2008-February-01, 15:52

Well, the questions are clearly related. If 3C does not agree both majors (and I don't think it does) then 3M has to be forcing because there is no other way for partner to search for a major suit fit. In that case I don't think that 3C shows less strength than 4C (as both are GF).

I still prefer 4C which I think does show both majors and club shortness. Maybe the hand is too weak but it seems the best description.

But again, if someone comes around and tells me "4C shows shortness and long diamonds and that's standard" I wouldn't be surprised. This is a very good topic and I'd like to hear more about it from others.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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Posted 2008-February-01, 15:59

Hannie, on Feb 1 2008, 04:52 PM, said:

Well, the questions are clearly related. If 3C does not agree both majors (and I don't think it does) then 3M has to be forcing because there is no other way for partner to search for a major suit fit. In that case I don't think that 3C shows less strength than 4C (as both are GF).

I still prefer 4C which I think does show both majors and club shortness. Maybe the hand is too weak but it seems the best description.

But again, if someone comes around and tells me "4C shows shortness and long diamonds and that's standard" I wouldn't be surprised. This is a very good topic and I'd like to hear more about it from others.

Hi,

I think that solid diamonds is not a possible hand type for 3C here, nor is 18-19 balanced with no club stopper since both of those hands are Xs of 2N (or if the solid diamond hand is too weak, 3D). This seems to leave 3C open as 4-4 majors, so you don't need 3C to be a GF since responder can bid fairly accurately over this.

Without the 2N this auction is much much harder as I alluded to here http://squeezingthed...04/1c-2d-x.html in a similar but harder auction (1C-2D-X-p).

I think it is completely unplayable in the auction 1D-2C-X-p to play 3C as can be a non GF (ie inv) hand with 4-4 majors, yet I see a LOT of people bid this way with that hand type, even very good players.
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#17 User is offline   han 

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Posted 2008-February-01, 16:04

Yes, I realize that the 2NT bid allows you to play 3C as invitational. I would be a bit reluctant to use it undiscussed. I agree though that it makes perfect sense here, so maybe I shouldn't be afraid.
Please note: I am interested in boring, bog standard, 2/1.

- hrothgar
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#18 User is offline   joker_gib 

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Posted 2008-February-02, 03:51

3♣ seems OK
Alain
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