[helene_t]

If you've played bridge in the Netherlands you will have noticed that almost all Dutch players put "Acol" on their CC. This usually means that they play some semi-natural system, maybe similar to SEF, SAYC, 2/1, Goren or Culbertson but probably not similar to Acol. Last Saturday, playing the quarter-final of the open Dutch pairs cham'ships (not very strong field, to qualify you just have to be among the best two or three pairs at the selection round at your local club, and some clubs are very weak), this one took the cake:

Quote

General approach: Acol, forcing NT

Another pair played

Quote

General approach: Variant of Precision
1♣: 0+ clubs 10-15 HCP. Positive relay, semi-positive transfers responses
1♦: 0+ diamonds, 16+ HCP. Control responses
1NT: 8-11
2x: Strong with the opening suit or weak with the next suit

How can it be that people don't bother to look up the dictionary definition of a term before they put it on their CC, even in the "General approach" box? Maybe they learned it from the authors of "Van Start tot Finish", the official (sigh) teaching methods of the Dutch BF:

Term [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space]Should mean [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] vStF meaning
=============================================
Negative double [space] [space]Could be a one-suiter [space] [space] [space] [space] Could be a one-suiter
 [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] (or canape) too WEAK [space] [space] [space] [space](or canape) too 
 [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] (hence NEG) for a free-bid [space] STRONG for a free-bid
 [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space]
Niemeijer [space] [space] [space] [space] [space]An extended version [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space]Plain PS (why use an 
 [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space]of Puppet Stayman [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space]existing word when you
 [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space]can make up a new one?)
Acol [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] 4444, weak NT [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] 5443, strong NT
Stayman Relay [space] [space] [space]Pleonasm. [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] Can be weak with both
 [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space] [space]majors

[Fluffy]

Well, in spain playing ACOL it means you open 3NT with AKQxxxx in a minor (and everyone knows of this), this has to be funny or irritating if you are english and come to play here.

[kenberg]

And the car I drive is just like a Jaguar. Very similar. Maybe a difference or two. Or three. Or four. Well, it has four wheels.

[awm]

Some of this fuzziness is due to the way bidding systems are defined (or not defined) and the need for some players to have everything classed into bins they are familiar with.

Certainly here in the US I see a lot of people who claim to play "modified precision" even when their system includes things like: canape openings with 4-card majors, strong diamond/nebulous club, 1♦ "any opening hand with no 5-card major", etc.

As far as I can tell there are two main reasons for this, first that it's not really clear at what point changing the meaning of bids really causes you to be playing a different system. It seems reasonable that you can change any one thing and still claim it's basically the same system (ACOL with five-card majors, ACOL with strong notrumps) but once you start changing a lot of things it becomes vaguely ridiculous (ACOL with five-card majors, weak twos, strong notrumps, forcing 1NT response to 1M, and more robust 2/1s -- isn't really ACOL). The second issue is that sitting down at the table and telling someone "We play Goombah Club with Oopah Two bids and Gresh over 1NT" doesn't really help anybody (and in fact tends to annoy most people) and for some reason they'd rather hear "we play Modified Precision" even if the emphasis is very heavily on the modified.

[Stephen Tu]

My rant - Acol is not an acronym, so stop typing ACOL! (Acol is a street in London, on which there is a bridge club for which the system was named).

[BillHiggin]

Are all languages as sloppy as Dutch?

Large numbers of people are as sloppy with their use of language as the ones you know. I don't think it reflects on the language itself.

At one time, SAYC meant something more than "5 cad majors other than 2/1". Anymore, that is about all you can reliably assume from the statement "We play SAYC".

[han]

BillHiggin, on Apr 2 2007, 03:45 PM, said:

Large numbers of people are as sloppy with their use of language as the ones you know. I don't think it reflects on the language itself.

Thank you Bill. What we don't need is some Dane to tell us our language is sloppy.

[helene_t]

awm, on Apr 2 2007, 08:45 PM, said:

The second issue is that sitting down at the table and telling someone "We play Goombah Club with Oopah Two bids and Gresh over 1NT" doesn't really help anybody (and in fact tends to annoy most people) and for some reason they'd rather hear "we play Modified Precision" even if the emphasis is very heavily on the modified.

OK, calling the local variant of modified Goren "Biedermeijer" or "Bridgevejen" would not be very helpful in an international setting either, and you might as well call it "Acol". Then again, to a Dutch/Danish player the terms "Biedermeijer"/"Bridgevejen" are actually somewhat meaningful. Of course, ten years from now those terms will have faded into meaninglessness as well.

But what's wrong with simply "5443, 15-17, strong 2♣" ?

OK, I'm just an old reactionary who refuse to acknowledge that language evolves. Just like people calling all invertebrates "insects". Better just get used to it.

[Free]

In Belgium we have a similar problem. Whenever you say you're playing "a strong ♣ system", people always think you play "Treffle Squeeze", an old regional version which got some fame 50 years ago.

Just 2 weeks ago I had a similar situation: we sat down at the table, I explained "we play a strong ♣ system with transfer openings in 1&2 seat and a weak NT". We were playing MOSCITO, but since only 10 people know this in the entire country we explain it like this. Now we got the auction:
1♠* - pass - 2♣* - 3♣
3♥ - pass - 4♥ - pass
pass - pass

1♠ showing 4+♦ unbalanced
2♣ showing 5+♥

RHO complained that this didn't even look like "Treffle Squeeze". I couldn't resist telling her that it's not my problem if she thinks that "a strong ♣ system with transfer openings in 1&2 seat and a weak NT" is the same as TS (which is 4 card Majors, nebulous 1♦, strong NT)
We even brought our CC, which almost nobody does around here.

[Cascade]

We had a similar problem with the never-ending variations of ACOL in New Zealand.

At one national congress after playing against Acol - weak NT 4-card majors and Acol - strong NT 5-card majors and other variations someone who I cannot remember submitted the following to the daily bulletin:

A ny
C ount
O r
L ength

[SoTired]

helene_t, on Apr 3 2007, 04:20 AM, said:

OK, calling the local variant of modified Goren "Biedermeijer" or "Bridgevejen" would not be very helpful in an international setting either, and you might as well call it "Acol". Then again, to a Dutch/Danish player the terms "Biedermeijer"/"Bridgevejen" are actually somewhat meaningful. Of course, ten years from now those terms will have faded into meaninglessness as well.

To clarify.... "Dutch" and "Dane" mean the same, right? I mean, they both start with "D" and have something about people outside New York City... Similar to "Californian", "Redneck" and "nut case" all refer to the same thing.